Is the Vaus controller even supported by any NES emulator?
I mean, if the Retron guys can figure out how it works then maybe they can contribute that code to emulation projects or something.
Is the Vaus controller even supported by any NES emulator?
I mean, if the Retron guys can figure out how it works then maybe they can contribute that code to emulation projects or something.
eBay Auctions / GameTZ profile / DP Feedback / Youtube / Twitter / RateYourMusicOriginally Posted by Edmond Dantes
Thanks man!
Not to be a crt elitist, but isn't lag, however slight, the price you pay for hdmi gaming? My experience is that with 99% of games slight lag isn't a huge factor. Fighting Iron Mike on Punch-Out!! falls squarely in the 1%.
That isn't a problem with the RetroN5 and similar devices because emulation removes the problem of native resolutions.
See, when it comes to retro gaming, input lag on HDTVs is caused by the scaling buffering necessary to display the game on the screen. Unlike CRTs, HDTVs have native resolutions, typically 1080p (1920x1080) 720p (1280x720) and 480p (640×480).
Being generous and counting overscan (a relic of the fact that CRTs were so wildly different from one to the next) the NTSC NES has a native resolution of 256x224.
To display that on a 1080p tv, the tv has to scale the NES signal approximately 3.616 times. In other words, it has to interpret the crazy tiny resolution the NES is producing and calculate how to convert this into a native resolution and display it as normal. This is why there is a delay.
Witht he Retron5 though, its emulation, and the Retron5 itself natively runs at 720p. There is thus no input lag unless you run the system through an HDMI splitter.
check out my classic gaming review site: http://satoshimatrix.wordpress.com/
Thanks for the explanation. Makes sense now.
Fighters, Bullet hell SHMUPs, and arcade-type games once you reach the faster higher difficulty stages are all affected.
The problem is some gamers are playing on laggy HDTVs and blaming the Retron5. Many budget HDTV models do not have low-latency game modes and since manufacturers do not yet publish latency ratings, buying an HDTV from a department store is a crap shoot if you get a good set or not. I now strictly use a 1080p 23" ASUS monitor in my bedroom to play HD game consoles. It sits on top of a corner computer desk. I also have a 19" CRT in the monitor bay for playing retro games. PC monitors are genrally smaller than HDTV and have poor or no audio, but most PC monitors have zero overscan and ultra low latency. Some models you need to use a switch or pass-through device to send the audio to a separate speaker system.
Anyone experiencing issues with Punch out or other games, I urge you to plug the Retron5 into a 1080p PC monitor using a wired retro controller and see if your lag issues disappear. If so, it's your HDTV lagging and not the Retron.
Whatever the case all I know is that even the same tv can get a different rating sometimes due to better quality parts going to differing stores. What you get at Best Buy isnt' what you get at Walmart, Target or KMart.
This is my new tv from March. http://www.amazon.com/dp/B009LG6AW6/?tag=dislag-20
The vizio E291-A1i(i=internet wifi.) IT has a 25ms rating on it, and the best non-monitor is at 17ms at the site and costs triple for a smaller size by a few inches on a Sony with an added lag killing processor. I bought it at best buy and I know from my experiences of shitty lag on a Samsung LED TV that tricked me a couple years back, I know this one is solid just like the tv that got cracked before it. I can handle shooter, overly sensitive music games like Gitaroo Man, and other classic 2D twitchy games from the 80s/90s not made for such things great on it. Yes the Retron 5 is emulated, yes it thanks to that doesn't have the re-sampling lag an OEM system has going through a new TV, but all these TVs have some form of lag, but my experience is if you can get a set under 30ms you should be solid.
Upscaling is still happening, it's just happening at the Retron 5 end instead of the HDTV end. And since so many HDTV's these days have a 1080p native resolution, it's frequently still happening at the HDTV end as well.
The difference is that 720p is a native resolution of HDTVs. The RetroN5 doesn't upscale anything; it natively runs all of its emulators at 1280x720. 1080p tvs also have 720p modes and so you aren't upscaling to 1080p, you're just using the 720p mode. The result of this is that input lag on retro consoles is eliminated once you move to emulation, one of the key advantages over the original hardware of everything the Retron5 does.
This same advantage is present in the Ouya as well.
check out my classic gaming review site: http://satoshimatrix.wordpress.com/
Only some HDTV's.
Anything else with a different native resolution like 1080i or 1080p has to process the Retron 5's 720p output to adapt it for the set's native resolution by sending it through its internal scaling chip.
This isn't accurate, modern HDTV's have a fixed native resolution. Anything that doesn't match it, such as 720p for a 1080p tv and vice versa, must scale the signal to match.
You're only bypassing the HDTV's scaling chip with the Ouya or Retron 5 if it's a 720p native set. And even then, only if your set allows you to disable all post processing of the signal being sent to it (Such as a "game mode" setting). And even there, the Retron 5 itself is still processing the image since it can't render something like a SuperNes game in 720p and that comes at a penalty like any image processing does.
Last edited by Leo_A; 07-01-2014 at 06:11 AM.
No such thing as a 720p set either. Most "720p" sets use 1366x768 LCD displays with overscan so you still deal with scaling. A few 1080p sets also apply overscan to non-1080 sources also. It's the 2010s and overscan was largely an analog issue; why do we still have this problem with consumer sets???
Say what you will, but by and large PC monitors have the lowest lag compared to HDTVs, and manufacturers of monitors know this which is why they are starting to publish lag ratings for monitors now. No overscan and sub 1-frame latencies.
The gunfight minigame on Kirby's Adventure is a good way to check lag. Your opponent draws their weapon and you have to press A button before they fire. It displays your reaction time in 1/100 seconds onscreen. Granted your brain has a certain level of processing lag between when your eyes see the stimulus and when your thumb reacts. This reaction speed may vary slightly per individual but should be fairly consistent for a mentally prepared gamer. Whatever, a single video frame is 1/60 sec or 0.0167 so unless they are polling multiple times there is rounding error factored in. On NES with a CRT, I consistently get about 0.13 reaction speed and rarely hit 0.11. When I played the minigame on Wii-U NES Remix 2 using the Gamepad, I kept hitting 0.16 and losing the end boss. It took me several tries to hit the 0.15 required to win. The display lag of the Wii-U gamepad has been measured at 16.67ms, or one NTSC frame. Add one additional frame of lag to the display buffer of the emulator which totals to 0.033 and you're looking at the 0.03 difference I get between CRT and Wii-U, meaning the difference between winning the minigame or not.
Last edited by stardust4ever; 07-01-2014 at 06:20 AM.
Anyone here want an unused open boxed Retron5? Someone over at NintendoAge finally got one in the mail but decided they'd rather have Zelda junk or something. If you have an account there maybe this is the chance to get one instead of putting up with delays. I know Satoshi is banned, but someone could work as a go between on that one. :P
Hey FYI I'll be around a bit more. An hour or two ago I was banned from NintendoAge for making a comment about someone indirectly but clearly obvious who it was. He's the maker of a nice game, and I enjoyed it, but said that I could never trust sucha person with my name or home address to buy a copy of it that just went back into stock. Because of that I got banned because it was considering thread crapping, slandering, and verbally assaulting a 'trusted member' and seller on the site.
For years he's publicly attempted to repeatedly humiliate me on that website straight up calling me stupid, mocking my intelligence, soft name calling, snarking on anything I say so I look dumb. No one would do shit about it up until recently when we were both required to FOE(full visual block) of each other. I had no idea he was missing, for all I knew with there 'were am I' thread going on it was another of those joke threads. Whatever the case is, because I called an internet harassers behavior into question on trusting buying an item I got the boot after 4 years.
The point of this is if anyone from NA who co-posts here cares to let people know I will no longer be capable of assisting anyone on that site with forwarding any needs they had with the Retron5 being repaired for bugs. I can continue to do that here where things are less tight about calling out issues. I doubt it's a temp ban since I've had no mail stating otherwise and I'm in some way not surprised really since I'm not a collector and clash often over that fact.
I don't know what it is with those people. Alas. I want to bring this back on topic since I got my Retron 5 today. I updated it to 1.4, tested a few games, and am mostly happy with it -- however, it deleted my completed save game from my Mother 3 repro (this one: http://store.retroquestgames.com/oth...08&id=26682452), so I'm not super happy about that. I thought this was fixed in 1.4? Or at least I'd read otherwise somewhere... maybe NA. Otherwise, the only problem I've run into is that it wouldn't load my save game from Secret of Mana.
In any case... I have no idea whether they read their Facebook messages, but if you can pass the word along, it's much appreciated! I'm digging the system quite a bit, otherwise. Which is a surprise, for me, because it's Hyperkin.
You really don't know when to let things go, do you? You were banned prior because of your negative attitude and antagonizing posts towards so many people in the past, and yet you didn't learn. Now you wanna bring the drama here? Seriously dude, grow up. Maybe it was mandatory for you to foe me, but I certainly wasn't forced to foe you. Maybe one day you'll open your eyes and see what a real douche you are. It's pretty sad that I got over 2 dozen text messages about your shitty post when I haven't visited NA in about a month because of your general disregard for common sense and common decency towards others. Your trust issues are misplaced, and it's sad you can't see that as I've never said anything to you on that level to earn that sort of slander from you. You're toxic to every forum you post on.
It's also nice to see you place DP in 2nd place to NA, and openly broadcast that. It's nice to see a slight bit of honesty from you for once.
Currently Playing: Super Mario RPG (Wii VC), Ghostbusters (Wii), DJ Hero (360, 5* All songs on Expert), Mario Kart Wii
You were banned for Slandering a highly respected member and homebrewer of Nintendoage in a thread that had something to do with his business. Please don't try to act innocent and only post your side of the story. You and This member of Nintendoage had problems, but you have had some very snarky remarks to him yourself, so don't act like you're the victim here. You're as much of an aggressor as anyone else was, and even more-so for trying to slander this person on a thread that may affect his business. I've never seen him post in your FS/FO thread calling you out of being untrustworthy or afraid to give you his address becasue you might harm him. The internet is a large place, but running to other forums and whining are NOT going to solve your problems.
Good Day Sir.
Edit: Never mind, found my answer.
I didn't slander anyone. What I said, the little I said in that thread was the truth. I don't trust him so if I wanted the game I'd have to get it from another source because I can't trust him with my real name and address. That's not slander. Slander by definition is putting forth lies. He has harassed me for the better part of 3 years on there trolling me publicly and privately with insults and snotty comments. I find it amusing someone who is that abusive of multiple members would be considered highly respected. It kind of shows the core value there of protecting friends and developers over doing what's right. I don't appreciate the innocence act either.
You can try and defend the behavior, that's fine, whatever makes you feel better about yourself. It is what it is.
News flash I did NOT post a word in his for sale or for thread post. It was a random post by a random person in the brewery section of the board. There was no threadcrapping done in the least bit with what I said, it's just a convenient excuse to do what was done and nothing more than that. I have had snarky comments towards him too, and in every single case it was retaliatory, never instigating.
I was told both parties were required to FOE, so if that is the case and it wasn't, then I was lied to by the staff which says a heap to me.
That's it, and done, if you want to carry this on make another thread as it's unfair to the R5 owners and I wish I had made a stand alone.
Nusilver -- I can talk to him and pass that along. I've had a similar issue. Does the MOther 3 cart when you start it detect correctly or come up as an unknown game? If it shows up as unknown it won't know how to handle the save data going back to the cart and usually it shouldn't even pull it either. That's probably what caused it. The only other save issue I know of currently is EEPROM data can be read but can not be written back to the games.
This right there is slander. If calling you out on your bullshit is harassment, then so be it. It's sad that you think you're really that much of a priority or that high up on my list of things to put effort into. But you're right, you've never said anything negative to me. I guess someone else logged into your account and told me to kill myself and the world would be a better place without me. You have such a selective, and blind sight on things because you truly think you're above others. All you do is play the victim card.
Sorry, you don't get to say when something is done. You want to spread nonsense and backward lies, you get to deal with the repercussions.
Currently Playing: Super Mario RPG (Wii VC), Ghostbusters (Wii), DJ Hero (360, 5* All songs on Expert), Mario Kart Wii
[QUOTE=Tanooki;2004016] Slander by definition is putting forth lies.
News flash I did NOT post a word in his for sale or for thread post. It was a random post by a random person in the brewery section of the board.
Do I need to screencap? I mean, it's not hard to do. Just because that "random" member posted about another member (the one you slandered), I'm sure you felt like you had to say something about it. Like you ALWAYS do. You were on "FOE" and you probably believed that the member you posted about wouldn't see it. Just because you talk down about someone in another thread doesn't change that you talked down about that member. It was worse that you did it in a thread that linked directly to his business though.
Last edited by ThreeGenGaming; 07-02-2014 at 05:44 PM.
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