Magnavox and the Patent

[SoulBlazer]

I've never seen this answered or explained anywhere, so I'm hoping someone can shed some light on this issue.

It's well documented that since Magnavox was the first system to release a home video game console, they took out a patent (or got it from Baer) on all video game consoles. When Atari released the 2600, they sued for royalities (or Atari offered them a fee, I forget right this moment) that was really a small ammount compared to what it should have been.

What I can't find is if this patent Magnavox had is still valid. Is it still any good? Did Magnavox get money for any other consoles released since then? Was it ever challenged in court?

Neither Phoenix or Ultimate History mention anything on this issue past the original case with Atari and if the patent is still good, Magnavox must have made some SERIOUS money over the last 20 years.

[chicnstu]

Interesting...

[SuperGunGuru]

This was discussed in my TC 391: Social History of Digital Games class (basically it's a fancy term for history of video games) last semester. Our prof said that Magnavox's patent is indeed still in effect today. He mentioned that with the next generation of systems, we may see them add more features besides playing DVD's and games in order to get around this patent by making more of an entertainment system as opposed to a plain video game system. If we see a bunch of new features for the next gen of consoles, don't be surprised. I also still have my textbook from the class. I could look in it to see if it talks about the patent. Our prof mentioned the money Magnavox had made all these years from the royalties and I believe that it was $29 million.

[qbertandernie]

what kick ass college do you go to that has a history of video games class?

what textbook do you use and if its something goofy could you buy one used for $15 or so?

[Joelius]

whoah, thats awesome. I wish i had that class offered in college. But interesting, I also never knew of the Magnavox patent.

[Ed Oscuro]

Name of said textbook? I've got to get a copy of that one. :)

That said, I was under the impression patents only last 10 years.

[kevincure]

I don't want to contradict your professor, but...there's no way Magnavox still holds patents in the US relating to videogames. Patents in the US used to last 17 years after filing (or less if it was what was called a design patents, which I imagine many of the Magnavox patents wer), which means the various Sanders/Magnavox patents would have expired between 1983 and 1990.

Afaik, Magnovox had a standard licensing agreement with companies after Atari. I'm not sure how this affected early Japanese systems, since crossborder patent protection wasn't the same in the 70s/80s as it is today. You may note, however, how many consoles before the late 80s had planned disc drive/keyboard components (i.e. - "This is a computer, not a videogame system!") and how few consoles after the time had such components.

[SoulBlazer]

If anyone has the books, you can find mention of this on Page 15 of Phoenix and Page 47 of Ultimate History.

Thanks for the information -- I'm very curious to know if Magnavox does indeed still press the patent today and how much they made from it. Anyone know anything else?

[rolenta]

The patent is no longer valid. Patents are only good for 20 years from when they were filed.

By the way, Ralph's book, Videogames: In The Beginning, will be available in March. It's FINALLY going to the printer this week after many many delays.

[Phosphor Dot Fossils]

Go ahead and sign me up for a copy. But I think I've told you that every time you've mentioned it so far.

[SuperGunGuru]

The book we used for class was "The Ultimate History of Video Games." We only had to read around half of it for our assigned readings, but I ended up reading most of it because I found it really interesting. The class is offered sometimes as a special topics in Telecommunications here at Michigan State.

[SuperGunGuru]

I just did some research on the subject. Here's a link to the actual patent from the US patent office. http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-P...alph+AND+Baer)

It appears to be a reissue of the original patent. If that's the case, that may explain why more recent consoles are still paying royalties

[lendelin]

The patent is no longer valid. Patents are only good for 20 years from when they were filed.

By the way, Ralph's book, Videogames: In The Beginning, will be available in March. It's FINALLY going to the printer this week after many many delays.

That is good news! I'll buy it for sure! I'm glad that Ralph Baer tells the story from his perspective after others were in the spotlight for many years.

[rolenta]

I pointed Ralph Baer to this topic and this is what he wrote back to me:

"US patents issued in the 1970's were valid for 17 years and that's that.

Trying to use the Re-Issue patents of '480 and '284 to sign up Sony or MSFT was never attempted. Nintendo got a paid-up license after they tried and failed to get the patents invalidated in thde eighties. Sony and MSFT got into the business much later and obviously there was no desire on Magnavox' part to go out and sue these two companies.

There have been no active licensing arrangements for well over ten years. Magnavox (or Sanders, now BAE) have not collected royalties for at least ten years and then only for past infringement (as from Taito and Data-East for arcade machines that infringed).

Referring to "the" patent (presumably the '480 patent) as being the patent on which royalties were based is also incorrect. In all of the lawsuits, at least three different patents were involved ('480, '285 , 284 )

Nothing is forever (except taxes)."

[Arcade Antics]

The patent is no longer valid. Patents are only good for 20 years from when they were filed.

By the way, Ralph's book, Videogames: In The Beginning, will be available in March. It's FINALLY going to the printer this week after many many delays.

Best news of 2005! Can't wait!!

[SoulBlazer]

Wow, I find it amazing that my simple question got the attention of the Father of Video Games himself.

Thanks, Leonard. You may want to mention that in the next edition of Phoenix, as I'm sure I'm not the only person who wondered about this. And there's nothing in Kent's book either.

So Nintendo was the last company that paid money to Maganavox for the patnet? Sega never did? Who is MSFT?

Is it possible that 29 million WAS the ammount that Maganox got over the years before the patent expired? Do you know how much Nintendo or Atari paid?

Please thank Mr. Baer for the information.

[rolenta]

Who is MSFT?

MicroSoFT

[SoulBlazer]

Okay....what about the rest of my questions? :P