Online MMO's ruined

[Gamereviewgod]

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=stor...i_te/everquest

This entire was absurd when the whole thing started a few years back. It's very clear exactly what it is: cheating. It's one thing to use a Gameshark or Action Replay in Metal Gear Solid 3 when you're playing by yourself. It's an entirely different issue to allow this type of thing in something that millions play together.

There's not even a reason to play anymore. What's the point? The people with the most money to blow will immediately become dominant; those who can't afford to buy $300 fake swords will become too frustrated to even try and play the game legitimately. If they actually do play it properly, it's only to make real money.

There's an argument out there that getting started in MMOs is very difficult. You're constantly under attack by stronger players. There's a problem for the design team to figure out. It's something that should be addressed long before the game ships. If it's bad now, how ridiculous is it going to be once this site starts and everyone can get their hands on weapons that should take hours (months even) to earn?

Also, what about those players who were banned for doing this same thing on eBay? Technically, at least now, they didn't do anything wrong. They just jumped the gun and suffered because of it. What's Sony going to do for them?

Then of course you have the cost issue. The game itself runs in the $50 range at retail. There's a monthly of $14.99. Right from the top, that's $65. Now you need to tack on an additional $300 to get you started with the right items (weapons, armor, gold) in the game, possibly more. You're not even getting anything for your money either.

This stuff doesn't exist. If you pay actual money for a piece of chain mail that exists only within a game, it's time to find some psychiatric help. If you don't have the time to properly build up your character, don't play the game. It's no more complicated than that. It's sad to see humans too lazy to even PLAY A GAME without having someone else do their work.

[Dahne]

Back when I played EverQuest (after the invention of fire, but before the steam engine), Ebaying wasn't too much of a problem. It was present, yes, but mostly done by a small set of people who devoted all of their time to it, and people willingto spend the money were rare. Some funny stories came of selling characters ("Hi, I'm a level 60 ogre warrior, what's taunt?"). The inflation rate in EQ is insane, anyway. Every expansion, you have to add bigger and better stuff to make people buy it. They release expanions, what, every few months? I don't even try to count how many EQ1 has now.

I can't imagine this official version being a good thing, but I really don't know how much of a bad one it'll turn out to be. It all depends on the price range, I think. If things are kept expensive, most people will still opt to get them for themselves ingame. If things are cheap enough that everyone can reasonably afford them, enough people will to force everyone else to just to stay competitive. Especially if PvP is involved. Oh, lord, if there's PvP involved...

Overall, this just makes me glad I don't play MMORPGs anymore.

[Dahne]

Eheh...

[Dahne]

Sorry about the triple-post. Bad forum! No biscuit.

[Queen Of The Felines]

I've been selling stuff for Ultima Online on ebay for a few years now. Nothing really major, just some crafted items that I had made. I made $100 in one week from doing that.

I don't know how things work in EverQuest, but in UO the really rare and powerful stuff only appears in the game about once a month at the most, so it's not like they're easily available on ebay.

Kristine

[Mangar]

Can't say i'm surprised.

As someone who leads a large MMO guild, has ran a rather popular Everquest Emulated server, and been playing these games for years - I've been saying for years that companys secretly condoned online sales of characters and items.

The thing to keep in mind is that despite what EULA's say, transferred or "sold" character accounts are *ACTIVE* accounts. IE: They remain paying customers. A canceled account is lost money. The sale of items and gold back and forth also creates paying accounts, as players who normally may have gotten bored or discouraged by their lack of forward progress - Can just purchase it. Thus making them happy and playing/paying, and the seller also playing/paying. It all comes down to subscription numbers, and all of this helps. Had a company really wanted to crack down on online sales, they would have. It's not difficult to track items, run stings, or compare billing info, and it's common knowledge in every single MMO community which accounts were "sold." My point being that if companys have ever actually WANTED to crack down on this behaviour, they would have. They chose to allow it.

The only difference this makes is that it allows Sony to reap some of the profits. With entire companys existing nowadays for the only purpose of selling and farming MMO gear and items(Running full back cover Ad's in major computer gaming magazines even), it was only natural for Sony and other firms to start wanting a piece of the profits. Ultima Online has been selling pre-made "leveled" characters for well over a year now, so this isn't really that big of a deal.

Don't get me wrong though. I'm not a fan of this. My only point is that this don't change the dynamic of MMO's at all. It's been going on for ages, and won't change. The only difference is that you have another "provider" for the same services that have been available for years.

[DynastyLawyer]

I likewise doubt this'll change anything. This happens all the time, under or over the table. Type in "Star Wars Galaxies Jedi" in Ebay, and you'll see an example of this insanity at work. I really can't fathom paying REAL money for FANTASY perks, but if that's your modus operandi, cool, man.

MMORPGS are big enough to have their own subcultures, and the "real-life entrepreneurs" are one type. They're clearly not out for the overall health of the game, but likewise, they are a rare and laughed-at breed. They aren't there to roleplay. They're there to look better than everyone else, and that's it. They get little respect (A common insult in galaxies is "you're Ebayed"), they get tired, and they sell their perks to someone else in due time.

If you're playing the game right, you learn to care about characters, reputation, and who's who. When that happens, you tend to fail to be able to sell your character.

[SkiDragon]

I think selling or buying (mostly buying) virtual items and stuff like this is just about the most pathetic and nerdy thing a person could possible do.

[GaijinPunch]

Dude... if you're spending well earned money on a virtual sword, you need to spend some time (and maybe money) on more important things, like getting laid.

[Graham Mitchell]

My friend plays Final Fantasy XI, and now hates it. The biggest reason she gets pissed is that people sell items and "game money" on ebay. Then, since you're forced to party up with people who LOOK like they've spent some time and have tough characters, everyone in her party dies in 5 minutes because not only are they reall rather weak despite having the best armor in the game, THEY DON'T KNOW HOW TO PLAY. They just bought their way in to a high-profile character, and have no clue what they're doing.

I guess Square cracks down on it, too. She says they have people employed to identify and shut down such auctions, but there are so many of them that they can't stop them all.

[Griking]

Dude... if you're spending well earned money on a virtual sword, you need to spend some time (and maybe money) on more important things, like getting laid.

The same can be said about many things including collecting old videogames.

I personally have no problem with people who sell virtual equipment for games. If they make good money off of it then I actually give them a lot of credit for it. The one thing that DOES bother me though is when they spam messageboards and games advertising their wares.

[Avatard]

Welcome to a 6 year old topic. Selling has awlays gone on and always will, if its with Soandso's companies blessing or not. It happens with almost every online game, even Gunbound, crazy huh? I've had friends make a good bit of cash selling in game stuff, and then turn around and use it to buy in game things to help them make more money.

Personally I've never spent real money for anything in a game and never plan too. Its not that I'm opposed to it really. if I'm spending a little to have more fun, it makes tons more sense than renting a DVD for entertainment, thats lost cash with nothing to show. But you can also make the argument that your cash is really just fake numbers in a database with no real backing that it is worth anything since we've left the gold standard. Its only worth something cause others think it is. If people think this electronic gear is worth something, then it is.

What it boils down to is the only thing that has real value is time. You can't get that back. I can change my own oil, but I spend cash to have it done quickly, is that dumb? I could get my own in game items, but if it would take me 15 hours heck yea I'd spend $1 to save 15 hours for example. Its not that I need it, its a luxury and you save 15 hours of your life. Sad? Maybe to some, but its all opinion, I view spending lots on renting movies sadder than buying in game items. But then again, its all just a form of wasting cash on entertainment.

[Lady Jaye]

Regarding the issue of newbies' difficulty to incorporate into the game -- isn't that what Blizzard tried to circumvent with World of Warcraft? Or is WoW also falling into the same traps than EQ, SW Galaxies, and other MMORPGs?

If any of you guys play WoW, is it the way that it is there too? I'm very curious to know.

[djbeatmongrel]

in city of heroes this peroblem isnt big becuasse theres no loot. the only thing sold is power leveling services and influence but not many people are stupid enoudh to buy it unless they are new, lazy, or both.

[calthaer]

I'm not surprised at all, but it is sort of disappointing. One would like to think that you're there to play a game, and that other people are also there for the same purpose. This system places the rewards of the game not in the hands of those who play it best, but those who have the most real-world wealth.

But, to be quite honest, this sort of thing is present in all areas of gaming to a certain extent. What are pre-order bonuses if not rewards given to those who pay the most money for the game? MMOGs have always rewarded people who can put the most time in over people who play the game most skillfully, so in that regard it has ALWAYS rewarded people with a pile of real-world wealth who don't have to work or go to school. What about the goodies given out at E3, or given away with Nintendo Power magazine, or that the video game store employees all hoard?

Gaming is not and probably never will be egalitarian without a concerted effort on the part of game companies to do so...and let's face it - most of them are primarily out to make a lot of profit (as opposed to primarily making good games), and an egalitarian system doesn't always bring in the most moolah.

[tuxedojoe]

I remember buying a few SOJ Rings back when I was a Diablo II LOD fanatic...

I don't think that the sale of virtual items is all that bad. It doesn't really have the big of an effect on me. I can still play the game legitmately if I want to. And, if I want to shell out a few bucks for some Stone of Jordan rings, then so be it.