Quote Originally Posted by lendelin View Post
This is a lot of euphemistic babble which sounds like a LR press release, too much to reply in a meaningful way. Let me address just two things:



1. Ebay scalping: It is not a Q if LR engages in ebay scalping, or if they invented it, or if they founded ebay. The fact is that LR tailors their businessmodel towards ebay scalpers, and then uses ebay scalping to push customers to buy their games. You draw a big separation line between LR and ebay scalping as an unfortunate and unavoidable consequence of modern times. That's not the case.

You and others and LR itself were very well aware of ebay scalping as soon as LR put limited production numbers on their games. You had to be a fool not to predict what happens next. Just read the first page of this thread shorty after LR was founded. Some expressed concern if the games would sell well enough, and then pointed to ebay scalping as an assurance that LR will sell their stock.

Quote: "And I suspect it'll go decently well for them since, even if the games stink, there are always collectors who want a rarity and scalpers who think they can make a buck off of rare games."

The answer to this post of the LR-guys themselves who went on a couple of websites to create a fanbase:

"Thank you for your support and understanding." (page 1, post #11, 10-15-2015)

And just a couple of weeks ago, when Strafe was sold, we all got in the mail this advertisement from Limited Run:

"The standard version of the game sold out several weeks ago and is already fetching several times the original retail price on secondary markets. (...) - head over to our site now and grab a copy!"

No, ebay scalping is not an unfortunate, unavoidable aftertaste of a wonderful heroic company. First, they created explicitly in interviews rarity hype (!) with the result of ebay scalping, and then they instrumentalize ebay scalping to push for sales of their games. A great company indeed. Artificially deflate the supply and artificially inflate the demand proved to be very successful.

And your reasoning that potentially everything nowadays, even my own toothbrush, might be a victim to ebay scalping reminds me of the reasoning that every game since Adam and Eve is potentially rare. It is ridiculous. LR actively uses ebay scalping as a sales strategy, while Nintendo, Sony, 505 Games or Soedesco do not although ebay scalpers use their products. Inflated ebay prices shortly after the release of a game happen but are very rare exceptions (in particular for indie games!), while they are the rule for LR games as the check for ebay prices clearly showed. And the reasoning that the majority of the games despite ebay scalping are in the hands of gamers and collectors is again euphemistic babble. If 60% were in the hands of gamers and 40% in the hands of scalpers, would that be satisfying? And should we really check additionally on the frequency of actual sales of the LR games on ebay? I think you'd be surprised.

The check of the average actual ebay prices for all the LR-games, but also in particular the high-in-demand games, showed that the factor 'ebay scalping' of the LR sales strategy works well indeed. The company achieved its goal. Once there is factual rarity hype of past games, it re-enforces rarity hype and drives sales of current games because they MIGHT (not necesserily are) pricey already a week after release. Rarity hype lives from uncertainty and the 'maybe'.

The nonsensical defense- and justification-reasoning can only be explained by this:



2. Fanbase creation: Your identification level with this company is incredibly high. You like these guys and admire them. They are like us, actually, you could be one of them. They created 'we' and 'us', and as soon as someone critisizes LR it is 'us' against 'them'. You accepted and swallowed everything bad and disadvantegous associated with their salesmodel. Everyone can see that their marketing strategy has only bad aspects for gamers and collectors, but you as part of them are no longer a customer, you are part of their business, and consequently, everything which helps them also helps you and -magically- everyone of us.

It was indeed a smart move of the LR-guys to go on websites like DP in this thread and flattering posters. This way they created a fanbase which roots for support and had high hopes that this company will do well.

I truly could understand your position IF Limited Run were the only company who puts great digital games on physical discs; but there were from the beginning of the LR-times other companies which started to do the same and don't rely on such a questionable salesmodel. Once in awhile a company puts production numbers on a game, see the collector editions of Tales of Zestiria and Tales of Berseria. In particular the latter immediately became the object of ebay scalpers to a disgusting extent. Limited Run put this bad program for regular releases in their name, centered their business model around rarity hype, created limited accessibility re-enforcing rarity hype as a fertile ground for ebay scalping. Good for them because they sell their stock of games, bad for us because they are doing it at the cost of gamers and collectors. Limited accessibility and inflated ebay prices are not a good service for gamers and collectors. Sales of these games can be done in a very different manner.

Soedesco has already or will release Rogue Stormers, 8-bit Armies, World to the West (!), Pharaonic and The Girl and the Robot within just two months. All of them nichey games on physical disc. We'll also get Matterfall (!), Inside/Limbo (!, 505 Games), and The Binding of Isaac: Afterbirth+, and these are the only recent ones which come to mind. And here are incredible news: All of them nichey games on physical disc WITHOUT limited accessibility of 30 minutes twice on one single day, without overpriced ebay selling beginning a couple of hours after the sales ended, and up for months so you can decide when and for which price you can purchase these games.

Incredible, it sounds like paradise for gamers and collectors, let's hope this utopian model will come true one day.
Honestly, you sound like someone that spends a lot of time sitting around sniffing your own exhaust. You asked me why I support LRG and its products and I explained it to you. In exchange you haven't addressed any of my points, but have gone off on some esoteric rant about how I'm too stupid to realize that I have been duped and about how LRG is somehow a terrible anti-consumer company because they use the potential for a sellout to move product.

We are never going to agree on these points and your arguments represent a black and white worldview that is not consistent with the way life and the world actually operates. There is plenty of room in the market for LRG and 505 and Soedesco and everyone else right now. Maybe that won't remain the case, but as a consumer I appreciate having options and LRG is just another option that has some great titles in their back catalog and in their upcoming catalog.

It's really not hard to figure out, I take two minutes on my phone, I pay the $25 and shipping most of the titles cost and then in a week or two I have yet another Vita or PS4 game physically. I don't ever have to deal with Ebay or scalpers or inflated prices of anything else. LRG isn't charging a crazy markup on these games based on comparables with the companies selling at retail and LRG has been transparent about their revenue split with the developers. I can't say the same for Soedesco or 505 or anyone else as they rarely update their websites let alone communicate directly with consumers.

I mean as near as I can tell, your whole rap seems to be that you want unlimited time to decide if you want a game and then you want to be able to wait for a price cut below MSRP. I just don't operate that way. I am happy to accept a discount through Amazon Prime or Best Buy GCU, but I don't sit around worrying about saving literally a few dollars on a $20 or $25 game. Maybe Soedesco and 505 and THQ and the others feel they can operate consistently selling their games to you and everyone who thinks like you do for under MSRP. Hopefully that is the case and they can actually profit and stay in business. Unfortunately, a lot of similar companies got wiped on in the last two generations pursuing that low cost retail model which is why companies like Majesco are now gone. Even Maximum games that published a lot of cheap games on the Wii has moved on to mid-range and full price games as they understand that the lower end of the market is a very tough space.