Remember nintendo's arrogance during nintendo 64's release?

[megasdkirby]

I tell you the worst thing about PS, pop-up, I mean you play Ridge Racer and all the sudden a huge mountain range pops up out of nowhere. Almost worse than fuzzy N64 graphics

This happens on other consoles as well, like the PSOne, Saturn, and Jaguar. It's all how the game was programmed...and in part with console limitations.

I never did mind the blurry graphics. I hated jaggy ones way more, for some odd reason.

[j_factor]

I tell you the worst thing about PS, pop-up, I mean you play Ridge Racer and all the sudden a huge mountain range pops up out of nowhere. Almost worse than fuzzy N64 graphics

Aside from a handful of games that really excelled in this regard, N64 was usually just as bad with pop-up (and Saturn too).

I remember the first time I played Crazy Taxi (arcade). I thought at the time, "Wow, this game has amazing draw distance! You can see forever!" Heh.

[sheath]

Pop-up, low resolution and/or low color texture mapping, pop-in, texture warping, blurring, obvious dithering, gameplay and camera glitches, and failed gameplay experiments are all common in this generation. Some of these console's popular games can make it seem like one console was "better" than another in some areas.

None of these consoles were better at all of them

[Rob2600]

Aside from a handful of games that really excelled in this regard, N64 was usually just as bad with pop-up (and Saturn too).

Pop-up, low resolution and/or low color texture mapping, pop-in, texture warping, blurring, obvious dithering, gameplay and camera glitches, and failed gameplay experiments are all common in this generation.

It depended on the game engine. Star Fox 64 and Ocarina of Time had huge draw distances with minimal pop-up and fog, and ran smoothly. Conker's Bad Fur Day had huge draw distances too, but the frame rate was often a little lower.

[sheath]

It depended on the game engine. Star Fox 64 and Ocarina of Time had huge draw distances with minimal pop-up and fog, and ran smoothly. Conker's Bad Fur Day had huge draw distances too, but the frame rate was often a little lower.

Conker had framerate issues, camera issues and low-end texture mapping problems. Ocarina was a steady but relatively low framerate for an action/adventure game, featured mostly non-descript textures of what seems like two colors, and also just could not keep the camera centered on the action. Star Fox 64 mainly just had fuzzy textures and some kind of overall screen blur that I don't see on 16-bit consoles over Composite.

I like all three of these games for different reasons, but I don't really enjoy playing any of them for completely different reasons than I just pointed out. Since we made them examples, they fit the model I just pointed out nicely. As do all of the "innovative" games from this generation.

[Rob2600]

Conker had framerate issues, camera issues and low-end texture mapping problems. Ocarina was a steady but relatively low framerate for an action/adventure game, featured mostly non-descript textures of what seems like two colors, and also just could not keep the camera centered on the action. Star Fox 64 mainly just had fuzzy textures and some kind of overall screen blur

I disagree. For the time (1997, 1998, and 2001), I think those three games featured excellent texturing, real time lighting, real time shadows/reflections, and huge draw distances...especially considering they're running on a 1996 machine (and without the Expansion Pak). They were certainly more impressive looking than anything on the PlayStation or Saturn at that time.

I used to work at Electronics Boutique and when Conker's Bad Fur Day came out, I put it on the TV and customers thought it was a Dreamcast game. Considering how hard Rare was pushing the N64, I'm surprised the frame rate is as high as it is! I wish it had been tweaked a bit more, but it's perfectly playable as it is.

Star Fox 64 was using full screen dithering which I hadn't seen in any other N64 game. I guess EAD was trying a different technique at the time. Remember, real-time 3D graphics was still in its infancy, so developers were continually experimenting with various methods and improving their tools. I definitely noticed Star Fox 64's dithering, but it didn't bother me. That game looked, ran, and played fantastic.

[sheath]

I disagree. For the time (1997, 1998, and 2001), I think those three games featured excellent texturing, real time lighting, real time shadows/reflections, and huge draw distances...especially considering they're running on a 1996 machine (and without the Expansion Pak). They were certainly more impressive looking than anything on the PlayStation or Saturn at that time.

I am not trying to be snide or anything other than honest here. But you just said you disagreed with my statement and then offered entirely different criteria. I am not saying these were bad games, non-impactful games, boring games, ugly games, or anything otherwise.

Whether or not they were "certainly more impressive looking" was utterly dependent on the player's experience with other hardware and games though.

[tom]

I love playing Conkers Bad Fur Day, but it's very fuzzy.

[buzz_n64]

Remember DP members arrogance during the nintendo 64 arrogance thread release?

Man, I'm surprised by the amount of hate I see towards Super Mario 64 and the Nintendo 64. SM64 just happens to be my favorite game of all time, until I recently played Super Mario Galaxy, now that game is my favorite. I have an idea, everyone state their favorite games and systems, and we'll all take turns bashing them as well.

[j_factor]

I don't think Star Fox 64 has a significantly better draw distance than other games of the time. I just went and played it to refresh my memory and check it against other games. The draw distance is only slightly longer than Panzer Dragoon II Zwei (which is also older). It's a little worse than Nanotek Warrior, although that game has a bit less going on. MDK is also a bit better.

The fog may make the transition easier on the eyes, though.

[The 1 2 P]

Man, I'm surprised by the amount of hate I see towards Super Mario 64 and the Nintendo 64.

I think it's just a simple matter of opinion. I played SM64 and didn't like it. I have nothing against it but it did not provide a compelling gaming experience for me. As for the N64, it's also one of my least favorite systems but mainly because of the controller. I would never say that it was a worthless system or has no good games because thats not my opinion of it. It has a nice, although small, collection of exclusives that I still collect for to this day.

Ultimately I think that most people(myself included) automatically compare the N64 to the other current systems at the time(PS1 and Saturn) and realize that they enjoyed playing those two systems much more than the N64. I have all three and I rarely ever go back to playing my N64. Not because I hate it but because I have more fun playing my Saturn and PS1.

[tom]

Remember DP members arrogance during the nintendo 64 arrogance thread release?

Man, I'm surprised by the amount of hate I see towards Super Mario 64 and the Nintendo 64. SM64 just happens to be my favorite game of all time, until I recently played Super Mario Galaxy, now that game is my favorite. I have an idea, everyone state their favorite games and systems, and we'll all take turns bashing them as well.

Nah, that just shows you're a Mario fan, maybe you should broaden your horizon. Mario 64, fave game of all time leaves a lot to be desired.

[Icarus Moonsight]

So, are you suggesting adaptation to "Hate the player, not the game"? I don't care if you sleep with the game nestled gently betwixt your bosoms. No sir, I don't like it. At least I like much less than most, apparently. Go dissenters! Tear down the Mushroom Castle, and eat the Princess. Umm, err.. Well, Bowser ate the heroes once already right?

[sheath]

When I think of Nintendo and arrogance at the same time I think about the N64's pre-launch hype, not the actual console or its games.

It took me a while to find this document on Project Reality. Here are some juicy quotes:

"The power of 64-bit technology is about to revolutionise the video and arcade games markets thanks to a joint development venture being undertaken by Silicon Graphics and leading video games manufacturer, Nintendo.

The venture known as Project Reality, will create Nintendo's next generation gaming system and combine three-dimensional graphics of the quality seen in films such as Jurassic Park and Terminator 2, with high- fidelity sound and an interaction speed around 10-15 times faster than the current 16-bit games. "

...

"Storage will be based on a revolutionary mega-memory silicon-based cartridge format which will allow the system to access a minimum of 100 megabits of data for each game, which is five to six times the memory of the current 16-bit games. The silicon-based cartridge format will have an access time two million times faster than that of current CD-ROM technology, providing a speed video users have so far only been able to dream about.

Project Reality, the first application of Nintendo's Reality Immersion Technology, will allow video game players to interact with virtual, infinitely evolving worlds which react instantaneously to their commands and whims. "

[Icarus Moonsight]

You can swap hype phrases and keywords and have a PS3 pre-launch advert. Death comes in three's they say.

[sheath]

You can swap hype phrases and keywords and have a PS3 pre-launch advert. Death comes in three's they say.

The PS2 was more like it, damn that thing's pre-launch hype. "It doesn't need texture memory, the Emotion Engine is powerful enough to render individual grains of wood in a door!"

-edit-

The thing that just eats at me about this kind of crap (and bloated specs) is that it I actually had to have conversations with people who thought all of it was true.

[Peonpiate]

I had both systems at release and my N64 collected dust compared to my Psx. The sheer number of games available on the Playstation just meant that there was always something to play on it.

Theres no bias from me for either system but thats how it was for most folks at the time.


But still...Mario Kart 64 was solid and so was Goldeneye, Zelda, Smash Bros, Perfect Dark and Paper Mario. Even though my N64 collected dust between first party releases, the game quality from Rare [and Nintendo themselves] was almost always worth owning a N64 for. So while the system wasnt played as much as say, the SNES was, I never regretted buying one.

So more than anything, the fact that the N64 lasted the entire generation with little third party support and still sold reasonably well rests entirely on Nintendo's and Rare's shoulders. If anyone should be arrogant its them [well, the developers of those games atleast-Miyamoto and CO].



On the other hand there are systems that were in a similar situation as the N64 [little third party support]...Atari with its Jaguar had 0 hope of being a success, absolutely none. Like the N64 the Jaguar had virtually no third party support, yet unlike Nintendo, Atari themselves cranked out gaming turds left and right to prop their system up...And the sales/reviews reflected it.

Nintendo's first party games were/are awesome, so the N64 sold based on that. If Nintendo's game division is arrogant then they should be.



As far as how the games hold up today, N64 games tend to hold up better graghics wise since of course they were using more advanced hardware. But you know what there are ways to mitigate that - run a Psx game through a emulator such Epsxe with the internal resolution cranked up and most of the flaws of Psx games go away. Some even look comparable to Dreamcast games. Xenogears running under Epsxe looks "great".

[buzz_n64]

Nah, that just shows you're a Mario fan, maybe you should broaden your horizon. Mario 64, fave game of all time leaves a lot to be desired.

Broaden my horizon? You're talking to a video game collector here who has over 1,400 game, and I've been gaming since the mid-late eighties. Also, like I've said at the very same time, I've broadened to include Super Mario Galaxy as my new favorite game.

I can't see where the Playstation has somebody's favorite game. Final Fantasy VII? I guess, if you can stomach turn-based RPGs. Castlelvania Symphony of the Night? To me, over-rated, sure it looks nice, but I have way more fun playing Super Castlevania IV.

[JSoup]

Broaden my horizon? You're talking to a video game collector here who has over 1,400 game, and I've been gaming since the mid-late eighties. Also, like I've said at the very same time, I've broadened to include Super Mario Galaxy as my new favorite game.

Trading a Mario game for a Mario game as your favorite further backs the 'that just shows you're a Mario fan' part.

[buzz_n64]

Trading a Mario game for a Mario game as your favorite further backs the 'that just shows you're a Mario fan' part.

Says the guy with a Mario avatar.

Yes, I am a Mario fan, but I'm not blinded by it. I dislike many Mario titles: Paper Mario, Super Mario Sunshine, Mario Kart Double Dash, most Mario Party games, Mario Pinball GBA, most educational titles... They could replace Super Mario 64 with Hello fucking Kitty and it would still be a good game. I respect the people who say it's not their cup of tea, but to call it a piece 'o shit is laughable, if not insulting.