RetroN 5 is officially a thing, apparently

[Tanooki]

Well Q1 is now->3/31 so who knows. Hopefully sooner than later as I want to see some hard reviews of the hardware and its features as I'd love to have one due to some of the perks of the systems it claims to have, but only if it's as rock solid as they claim with legit games.

I could see not having pre-crash systems for various reasons, but the one that gets me that's not in there is the TG16. I get not having the CD addon as that's just too much junk to handle and it does have a system card for that too, though it can be easily reverse engineered (like Magic Engine did many years ago on PC.) I think HuCards would have been a real boost to the system as it did have some really fine gaming moments on a few of them (had a Duo long ago) though I did prefer many CDs as well.

I think if this supposedly worked as well as advertised I'd probably hang up my pristine SNES system back into the box, and my modded top loader too, but this is all a huge IF. I do know I'd be greatly interested in buying up a good top10 or so of my favorite old Genesis games and there's some Famicom stuff I've always wanted to have too.

[JSoup]

So, for the hell of it, I got a couple photos of the Retron5 in action today. Pardon the crappy quality, I'm not accustomed to photographing an actively moving screen.




I realize now I should have just gotten an image of the just the machine itself and will probably do that tomorrow.

[Mr Mort]

Interesting. May I ask where these pics were taken?

[Satoshi_Matrix]

I was curious as to if the Retron5 could play Atari games as well and asked the same fellow I mentioned in my previous post about it. He said they couldn't build functionality into the hardware for pre-crash systems due to legal issues with the various rights holders. That struck me as odd, as this is basically claiming that Atari is more litigious than Nintendo which just doesn't seem possible.

That's complete bullshit. Just look atht he Coleco Gemini - which came out in 1983 or so. That was a complete hardware clone of the 2600 and when the 2600 was still alive. It was deemed legal because none of the parts used violated design patents, and were off-the-shelf parts. Now all these years later, the 2600 patents have long since expired and as long as Hyperkin doesn't include any built in games, theres nothing anyone could legally do about 2600 support.

A far, far more likely scenario is that they simply don't want to invest in the costs due to low user demand. I'd love 2600 support just as much as the next guy here, but we gotta face it, we're in the minority. The average joe who would buy this probably doesn't have a 2600 collection.

It's the same with the TG-16. It isn't that Hyperkin couldn't do it, it's that its not worth their while, plug TG-16 games have all that region coding crap to deal with the even the pure android emulators struggle with in pure software.

Well Q1 is now->3/31 so who knows.

Source? March 31st sounds.....tentative. Like, far enough away so we'll stop bitching that there is no release date, yet not so far away as to make us scream vaporware.

Interesting. May I ask where these pics were taken?

Me too. I'd like to know more details about this.

[TheChristoph]

I'd like to see the controller, and possibly hear impressions if possible. It seems like it's in the shot; the white object near the bottom of the table. I zoomed in on the photo and it seems like it's very oddly shaped.

[Tanooki]

I have no source, someone else here said it and I just pointed out q1 goes through March. I'd love a real date, but I think they'll just keep delaying it until they fix whatever the problem is this time or hope people forget and drop the whole thing.

[dgdgagdae]

Source? March 31st sounds.....tentative. Like, far enough away so we'll stop bitching that there is no release date, yet not so far away as to make us scream vaporware. .

He wasn't saying it would be released on March 31st, just that Q1 is from January 1 - March 31. As for a source:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calendar_year

[JSoup]

Interesting. May I ask where these pics were taken?

SacAnime 2014 Winter Show
http://www.sacconventions.com/

[Satoshi_Matrix]

As for the controller, here's the best shot of it thus far:



other shots are merely 3D mockups.

Here's what we do know about it:

This has two shoulder buttons not shown in that pic.
It's a standard bluetooth controller. It's possible the Ouya controller and many other bluetooth controllers will work with the Retron5, but that's speculation.
It will have a rechargable battery, not take AA's or something.
Button configurations are fully remappable for all emulators. You'll be able to map whatever control to whatever button on that.
You will be able to forsake the wireless controller entirely and use OEM or third party controllers for the original consoles should you so wish.


I've said so before, and I'll say it again: I am going to reserve judgement until I actually have the thing in my hands and use it. It could be crap, it could be incredible. I will refuse to judge it based solely on images.

The thumbstick could be a clickstick like the NeoGeo CD-Z or NeoGeo Pocket. If so, that's the best thing Hyperkin could have done, rather than come up with some dpad that doesn't infringe on Nintendo's, Sony's, or Microsoft's dpad designs. Copying the overall design of SNK (a company that doesn't exist anymore, at least not in the way we think of SNK) was a smart move and I fully support Hyperkin for doing so. But again, without actually using it, there's no way of telling how good or bad it is.

As for the release date, I don't expect to see it some out "any day now". If that were the case, Hyperkin wouldn't be keeping so quiet about it.

If i had to predict, I'd say the true release will probably be late spring or early summer. It won't be in a couple days or weeks.

[treismac]

Hmmmm... I can't even begin to imagine how that would feel in my hands. Here's hoping it rocks. If that's the case, and the system comes with two of them, the RetroN 5 might well be a complete no-brainer of a purchase.

[Satoshi_Matrix]

Hmmmm... I can't even begin to imagine how that would feel in my hands. Here's hoping it rocks. If that's the case, and the system comes with two of them, the RetroN 5 might well be a complete no-brainer of a purchase.

Given the complexity and costs involved with bluetooh controllers, it's highly improbable the RetroN5 will come with two of them. What will happen is that Hyperkin will package one in the for $99, and if you want another, they will sell for $49 (or more)

That's the way the Ouya does it, and Hyperkin is an even smaller company even more unable to take the kind of financial hit packaging two of these controllers with the system for $99 would be.

Think about that. It just won't happen.

All that said, do keep in mind that Hyperkin has stated the RetroN5 will be fully compatible with preexisting controllers that will be mappable for any system. For example, with an OEM SNES controller, you'll be able to use it to play all five system, even Genesis if you so choose. As a direct result, it becomes trivial if the bluetooth controller will be awful. Of course, I hope it won't be, as I like the concept of using a well designed wireless controller.

[Tanooki]

It would be impressive even as screwy as the molding looks if the thing was a great piece of work that you really would want to use. With it being bluetooth you could carry it over to other items as a nice controller potentially as well if another device will pick it up. It could show up on tablets, computers, etc which would be nice if a game could support it by just asking for a bluetooth controller being there.

[StoneAgeGamer]

From what I have head the controller is actually really nice and d-pad is much like the neo geo d-pads. I believe they use micro switches, from videos a saw are very clicky. I am suppose to be beta testing the R5 as a retailer. I haven't gotten my beta unit yet. Unfortunately there is probably not much I will be able to comment on since I had to sign an NDA.

[Satoshi_Matrix]

That makes me pleased. If it is a clickstick like the NeoGeos then it has a high chance of not being garbage.


Would that NDA prevent you from telling us basic info about the system? For example, I'd like to know what's all in the box (will they make you buy your own HDMI cable?) the exact power supply rating (so I can futureproof by having another compatible power supply should I decide to move the system from room to room without having to go behind the mess of wires to disconnect the power supply every single time) and general info like....when the heck we can expect this to be released instead of vaguely "sometime early 2014"?

[StoneAgeGamer]

That makes me pleased. If it is a clickstick like the NeoGeos then it has a high chance of not being garbage.


Would that NDA prevent you from telling us basic info about the system? For example, I'd like to know what's all in the box (will they make you buy your own HDMI cable?) the exact power supply rating (so I can futureproof by having another compatible power supply should I decide to move the system from room to room without having to go behind the mess of wires to disconnect the power supply every single time) and general info like....when the heck we can expect this to be released instead of vaguely "sometime early 2014"?

I know as much as you do on release date. They told me first quarter 2014. We took pre-orders and this is exactly why I hate taking pre-orders on this stuff because this always happens, but it feels like you have to to keep up with the Jones.

As for NDA I plan on asking what I can and can't divulge once I get it, but my guess is that they won't allow much unless that aspect was truly final. Even stuff it includes may not be final.

[Leo_A]

I hope it's nice. If they hit a home run with this and it's actually a good alternative to enjoy these games on a modern HDTV, it would be a shame to be all but limited to wired controllers.

The thumbstick could be a clickstick like the NeoGeo CD-Z or NeoGeo Pocket. If so, that's the best thing Hyperkin could have done, rather than come up with some dpad that doesn't infringe on Nintendo's, Sony's, or Microsoft's dpad designs.

They could've just directly copied the d-pad on the NES. That's what I'd of preferred and those patents are all expired.

It's the same with the TG-16. It isn't that Hyperkin couldn't do it, it's that its not worth their while, plug TG-16 games have all that region coding crap to deal with the even the pure android emulators struggle with in pure software.

I disagree

It very well might not be financially practical to pursue, but I don't think it's from a lack of gamer interest. Among those willing to spend over $100 on a device to improve their 8/16 bit Sega/Nintendo gaming experience in 2013, I think you'd find a healthy percentage of those individuals with some interest in the NEC platform from that time.

Plus, aren't they also selling these in Japan where that system was a much larger success? Much like how I bet the North American market wasn't the driving force behind them making revisions to accommodate Master System gaming (I would imagine Europe is more to thank for that), that's something that it has in its favor.

[Gameguy]

It very well might not be financially practical to pursue, but I don't think it's from a lack of gamer interest. Among those willing to spend over $100 on a device to improve their 8/16 bit Sega/Nintendo gaming experience in 2013, I think you'd find a healthy percentage of those individuals with some interest in the NEC platform from that time.

I agree with this, I do think there's plenty of demand for Turbografx clones. It probably would cost more to manufacture which is why it isn't done. If any company made a clone Turbo Duo system I'm sure it would get major interest, since these are so expensive and seem to self destruct with age.

Instead we keep getting NES, SNES, and Genesis clones. Hardware that's still easy and cheap enough to find almost anywhere.

[treismac]

... we keep getting NES, SNES, and Genesis clones. Hardware that's still easy and cheap enough to find almost anywhere.

I wonder what kind of market there is for the Genesis these days anyway, as I never see the system selling for much. Just today at the same pawn shop that had a NES selling for $100 and a SNES for $85, there sat a [model 1] Genesis for $19.99.

Uhhhh... I'm just going to bust out a new thread for this rather than clunk up the RetroN 5 thread.

[Satoshi_Matrix]

I hope it's nice. If they hit a home run with this and it's actually a good alternative to enjoy these games on a modern HDTV, it would be a shame to be all but limited to wired controllers.

I'm alright with wireless controllers, but there's a lot to be said for wired controllers, especially OEM ones. A big part of the console experience is using the original controller it was designed with. Another factor is that whenever you have wireless controllers, you have battery life concerns.

While true that on the flipside cords can be tripped over and are a pain to deal with if you have small kids or dogs, but overall, wired is better than wireless when it comes to retro gaming.

They could've just directly copied the d-pad on the NES. That's what I'd of preferred and those patents are all expired.

Legally they can't. Nintendo has continually renewed and reused their cross shaped design on every console they're produced. Unlike the NES hardware, the design of the dpad - the overall shape, etc, is very much legally owned to Nintendo. Hyperkin can't copy it any more than Sony or Microsoft could.

It very well might not be financially practical to pursue, but I don't think it's from a lack of gamer interest. Among those willing to spend over $100 on a device to improve their 8/16 bit Sega/Nintendo gaming experience in 2013, I think you'd find a healthy percentage of those individuals with some interest in the NEC platform from that time.

I really, really don't think so. You might find a vocal minority on retro gaming forums like this one, but overall, I'd be shocked if even one tenth of the overall number of gamers who plan to buy the RetroN5 would actively care if Hyperkin added TG16/PCE support. True, such support might generate additional interest in the platform, but I do not believe interest preexists in the majority of gamers.

If it did, there would already be a market for PC Engine clones, PC Engine games would be common in retro game shops, and the online community would rival Nintendo's.

None of that is true. Only a small percentage of gamers remember the TG16 at all, let alone have heavy nostalgia for it to the point where including support in a clone like this would be justified.

Once again. I'm not saying that I wouldn't fully embrace PCE support. I'd love them to do that. All I'm pointing out are the reasons why that has a snowflake's chance in hell of happening. If the RetorN5 was made specifically for the Japanese market, it *might* happen, but for the west? No way.

I do think there's plenty of demand for Turbografx clones. It probably would cost more to manufacture which is why it isn't done. If any company made a clone Turbo Duo system I'm sure it would get major interest, since these are so expensive and seem to self destruct with age.

Instead we keep getting NES, SNES, and Genesis clones. Hardware that's still easy and cheap enough to find almost anywhere.

Stop to consider why we keep getting NES/SNES/Genesis clones. A big reason is because there's market demand for them. Because those were all successful platforms back in the day, and games in those formats are still readily available nearly anywhere.

The Turbo is not in that category. The system was an abysmal failure in the west in terms of sales and market penetration. TG16 games are exceedingly rare sights in your average game shop except perhaps in extremely large US cities.

Again, there might be a vocal minority of gamers on forums who want TG16 clones, but the reason that hasn't happened is because there isn't a large enough percentage of the retro gaming community to make it happen.



[QUOTE=treismac;1991369]I wonder what kind of market there is for the Genesis these days anyway, as I never see the system selling for much. Just today at the same pawn shop that had a NES selling for $100 and a SNES for $85, there sat a [model 1] Genesis for $19.99./QUOTE]


I think it has a lot to do with supply and demand. Sega consoles - once neck-and-neck rivals with Nintendo in the 16 bit generation - just don't have the same market demand as Nintendo consoles. I know the owner of a retro gaming store in my town and talk to him often about stuff he gets in and sells. That store isn't small, and stocks hundreds of thousands of games for many platforms.

Yet, he doesn't sell anything Sega. No Sega consoles, no Sega games. Not Master System, Genesis, Saturn, Dreamcast or GameGear. The reason? In his own words,

"they simply don't sell. People always want Nintendo games, but never the Sega ones. When I did sell them, most of what I'd get would be sports games that would sit on the shelves for months unsold for asking prices like $.99 or even $.50. They just aren't worth my while to stock."

As the Genesis was common yet nobody wants it much, the supply exceeds the demand, and thats how you end up with a price gap between Nintendo and Sega consoles. This might not be true everywhere, but I do think its a common enough occurrence to be at least a bit noticable no matter where you live reading this.

[Leo_A]

I'm alright with wireless controllers, but there's a lot to be said for wired controllers, especially OEM ones. A big part of the console experience is using the original controller it was designed with. Another factor is that whenever you have wireless controllers, you have battery life concerns.

While true that on the flipside cords can be tripped over and are a pain to deal with if you have small kids or dogs, but overall, wired is better than wireless when it comes to retro gaming.

Yeah, but the primary purpose of the Retron 5 seems to be to bring retro gaming back into the living room. So hopefully the wireless option is a viable one since that convenience is one of the features people will be seeking this out for.

Legally they can't. Nintendo has continually renewed and reused their cross shaped design on every console they're produced. Unlike the NES hardware, the design of the dpad - the overall shape, etc, is very much legally owned to Nintendo. Hyperkin can't copy it any more than Sony or Microsoft could.

How? Isn't it just protected by patents? I wasn't aware that those could be renewed. And using Google just now, it seems like a lot of people are under the same impression I had. It was only protected by patents and said patents have now expired.

Stop to consider why we keep getting NES/SNES/Genesis clones. A big reason is because there's market demand for them. Because those were all successful platforms back in the day, and games in those formats are still readily available nearly anywhere.

Well, I don't think that we're trying to incorrectly revise history and you're quite right about the popularity of the competition and why they're the focus here. But I still think that among the segment excited about a relatively expensive device for their classic gaming hobby that a lot of those Sega & Nintendo fans today also have an interest in the TurboGrafx.

They're going to need some hook to get us to buy revisions especially if they do a nice job with the Retron 5. And the most obvious way is to increase their system coverage. Among consoles they're not already emulating here, it's the best candidate with the most interest overlap.

And in the handheld realm, I imagine most everyone would agree that Game Gear would top the list by a wide margin.