Roundtable Top 100. Ever. [09/20/04 UPDATE]

[digitalpress]

Best games ever = the games that you, the gaming community, feel are the best games ever made. Not the most significant. Not the ones that were best AT THAT TIME. The ones that are the best today. Classic games that have stood the test of time and originals that are better than any sequel to follow apply, as does a game that was released last year.

This may seem like a daunting task, but I can't think of a community more familiar with building, tearing down, and tweaking game lists like the gang here. Let us proceed. This list consists of "home games", and can include computer games, handheld games, and console games. Not arcade games. That's for another list on another day.

Try to vote or dispute only on games that you have personally played. We'll address the obscure games separately so don't vote a game out just because you never heard of it.

Also note that we won't include "series" or "compilations" of any kind. A game has to stand on its own - though it may have stood on several platforms, assume "the one you like best" when voting in future.

UPDATED 09/20/04: Your job now is to lobby for games that are "missing", and you should also name a game to be removed. In order for this to happen, someone will need to SECOND your motion, so make your argument a convincing one!

Adventure (2600)
Baldur's Gate 2 (PC)
Bard's Tale, The (C64)
Baseball Stars (NES)
Blazing Lazers (TG-16)
Bonk's Revenge (TG-16)
Bubble Bobble (NES/SMS/PSX)
Burgertime (Intellivision)
Castlevania Symphony of the Night (PSX)
Chrono Trigger (SNES)
Civilization II (PC)
Devil's Crush (TG-16)
Diablo (PC/PSX)
Donkey Kong aka Donkey Kong '94 (Game Boy)
Dracula X (PCE Duo)
Dragon Warrior IV (NES)
Dragonstomper (2600)
Dreadnaught Factor (Intellivision,/5200)
Elite (C64)
Final Fantasy III (SNES)
Final Fantasy VII (PSX)
Goldeneye 007 (N64)
Grand Theft Auto: Vice City (PS2)
Grim Fandango (PC)
Guardian Heroes (Saturn)
Gunstar Heroes(Genesis)
Half-Life (PC)
Incredible Wizard, The (Bally Astrocade)
Jet Grind Radio (DC)
Kaboom! (2600)
Legend of Zelda, The (NES)
Legend of Zelda, The: Link to the Past (SNES)
Legend of Zelda, The: Ocarina of Time (N64)
Lode Runner (C64, Apple II, others)
Lords of Thunder (Duo)
Lunar: Silver Star Story (Sega CD)
Mega Man 2 (NES)
Metal Gear Solid (PSX)
Metal Slug 3 (Neo-Geo)
Metroid (NES)
Metroid Prime (GC)
Microsurgeon (Intellivision)
Mike Tyson's Punch Out (NES)
Military Madness (TG-16)
Miner 2049'er (800)
Monkey Island 2: LeChuck's Revenge (PC)
Ms Pac-Man (7800)
MULE (C64)
MUSHA (Genesis)
Nights into Dreams (Saturn)
NightWarriors: Darkstalkers' Revenge (Saturn)
Ninja Gaiden (NES)
Panzer Dragoon Saga (Saturn)
Phantasy Star IV (Genesis)
Phantasy Star Online (Dreamcast)
Pirates! (C64)
Pitfall II (5200)
Point Blank (PSX)
Radiant Silvergun (Saturn)
River City Ransom (NES)
R-Type (TG-16)
Samurai Shodown 2 (Neo Geo)
Saturn Bomberman (Saturn)
Secret of Mana (SNES)
Shining Force CD (Sega CD)
Sim City 2000 (PC)
Snatcher (Sega CD)
Sonic CD (Sega CD)
Soul Calibur(DC)
Space Invaders (2600)
Star Control 2 (PC/3DO)
Star Raiders (5200/Atari 8-bit)
Streets of Rage 2 (Genesis)
Suikoden II (PSX)
Super Mario Bros. (NES)
Super Mario Bros. 3 (NES)
Super Mario Kart (SNES)
Super Mario World (SNES)
Super Mario World 64 (N64)
Super Metroid (SNES)
Super Punch-Out!! (SNES)
Super Smash Bros. Melee (GCN)
Super Street Fighter II Turbo (3DO)
Tecmo Super Bowl (NES)
Tempest 2000 (Jaguar)
Terranigma (SNES import)
Tetris (Game Boy)
Tetris Attack (SNES)
Toe Jam & Earl (Genesis)
Tony Hawk Pro Skater 3
Twisted Metal 2 (PSX)
Ultima IV (Apple II/C64/PC)
Ultimate Wizard (C64)
Utopia (Intellivision)
Vib Ribbon (PSX)
Warlords (2600)
Wasteland (C64)
Wipeout XL (PSX)
Wonder Boy III: The Dragon's Trap (SMS)

[Gamereviewgod]

Samurai Showdown 2
Final Fight (Sega CD)
Mario 3
Tetris (any)
Street Fighter II Turbo (SNES and or/3DO)
Double Dragon (Genesis)

[ManekiNeko]

Me! Me!!!
Here's my list, in no particular order:

Bubble Bobble
Galaga
Ms. Pac-Man
Arkanoid
NightWarriors: Darkstalkers' Revenge
Street Fighter Alpha 2
Super Mario Bros. 3
Gunstar Heroes
Radiant Silvergun
Guardian Heroes

JR

[digitalpress]

Bomberman Party Edition (PSX)
Doom II (PC)
Elite (C64)
Final Fantasy III (SNES)
Legend of Zelda (NES)
Metal Slug (Neo-Geo)
Pirates! (C64)
Streets of Rage (Genesis)
Super Punch-Out!! (SNES)
Tempest 2000 (Jaguar)

[Arcade Antics]

Here are a few... (more to come)

Adventure (2600)
H.E.R.O. (2600)
Kaboom! (2600)

[IntvGene]

Adventure
Utopia
Ultima IV
King's Quest
Doom
Super Mario Bros.
Yar's Revenge
Dune II
Kaboom!
Pitfall II

[RCorcoran]

Deluxe Galaga (Amiga)
The Bard's Tale (C64)
Adventure (VCS)
Doom (PC)
Night Stalker (Intellivision)

[NE146]

I'm sure I'll regret some of these and want to change them later.. but what the heck.

Adventure - 2600
Castlevania SOTN - PSX
Gunstar Heroes - Genesis
Zelda - Link to the Past - SNES
Military Madness - TG-16
Super Mario Kart - SNES
Mega Man 2 - NES
Blazing Lazers - TG16
Chrono Trigger - SNES
and yes.. Banjo Kazooie - N64!

[Scoots]

1 Ms Pac-Man (7800)
2 Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past (SNES)
3 Legend of Zelda (NES)
4 Super Mario Bros (NES)
5 Metroid (NES)
6 Kid Icarus (NES)
7 RC Pro-Am (NES)
8 Centipede (7800)
9 Microsurgeon (Intellivision)
10 Burgertime (Intellivision)

[hezeuschrist]

Wow, daunting task indeed.

Final Fantasy II
Half-Life (and all subsequent mods)
Super Mario 3
EverQuest
Diablo
Warcraft 2
Sim City 2000
007: Goldeneye
The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past
And my all time number one... NES - The Goonies II

I tossed around all the SNES Squaresoft games that had a major impact (FF2, FF3, Secret of Mana, Chrono Trigger) but ultimately decided that FF2 had become the building block for most of them while already improving on a great formula. Not to mention a kick ass story.

And Everquest... Ugh, as much as I now despise the game, it deserves credit. The MMORPG market is going to be a permenant mainstay in todays gaming world and all of them will ultimately be compared to EQ until someone actually does the genre right. Cmon Blizzard, pull through!

[Ascending Wordsmith]

Bonk's Revenge
Saturn Bomberman
River City Ransom
Gunstar Heroes
Blades of Vengeance
Grand Theft Auto III
Super Mario All-Stars
Twisted Metal 2
Mario Party
Metal Slug X

[Goblin]

Tetris (any)
Pole Position II (7800)
Miner 2049er (800)
Jordan vs Bird (800)
Kaboom (2600)
Pole Position (2600)
Raiden (Jaguar)
HoTD (DC)
SMB (NES)
UN Squadron (SNES)

[Kid Fenris]

I assume this is supposed to be a list of my favorite games, and not the games that I'd objectively consider the best ever. So here it goes.

Radiant Silvergun (Saturn, Import)
Final Fantasy VII (PSX)
Gunstar Heroes (Genesis)
Valkyrie Profile (PSX)
Final Fantasy III/VI (SNES/PSX)
Metal Gear Solid (PSX)
Panzer Dragoon Saga (Saturn)
Xenogears (PSX)
Guardian Heroes (Saturn)
Super Metroid (SNES)

If imports aren't included, substitute Crystalis (NES) for Radiant.

[Sniderman]

Venture (Colecovision)
Sonic the Hedgehog (Genesis)
The Immortal (Genesis)
Dragonstomper (AT2600 - Supercharger)
Shining Force CD (Sega CD)
Sonic CD (Sega CD)
Tetris (Gameboy)
APB (Lynx)
Dragon's Lair (3DO)
Night Trap (Sega CD)
I have no idea why I picked these in particular. very stream-of-consciousness going on here....

[k8track]

All righty, let's give it a go:

Pitfall 2 (2600)*
The Incredible Wizard (Bally Astrocade)
Boulder Dash II (Commodore 64)
Rygar (NES)
Metroid (NES)
Super Metroid (SNES)*
Venture (Colecovision)
Wonder Boy III: The Dragon's Trap (SMS)
Utopia (Intellivision)
Intelligent Qube (PS1)

* = tied for position of my absolute favorite.

Argh, that was painful. Couldn't even include any 5200 games. Wow, that hurt. Ow. Ow. Ow.

[ghsqb]

Oh my, how do you choose!

Heres my first effort in no particular order:

Legend Of Zelda (NES)
Gran Turismo (PSX)
Final Fantasy 3 (SNES)
Mike Tysons Punch Out (NES)
Shining Force (Genesis)
Burgertime (Intellivision)
Lunar: Silver Star Story (Sega CD)
Chrono Trigger (SNES)
Tetris (Any)
GoldenEye (N64)

[k8track]

@Sniderman,

Hey, while I was typing my list, you picked Venture as well! What a great surprise. I feel validated that a distinguished luminary such as yourself would agree with me. I prostrate myself at your feet. Great minds think alike, it would seem.

[Charlie]

Games that I don't know if anyone else would think of, but of which I consider to be five-star classics in every sense of the word.

Pokemon Puzzle League (Nintendo 64)
Goonies 2 (NES)
Star Tropics (NES)
Donkey Kong (aka Donkey Kong '94. Gameboy)
Legend of Zelda: Oracle Series (Gameboy Color)
Point Blank seires (PSX)
Super Mario Sunshine (Gamecube)
Mario Party 4 (Gamecube)
Soul Caliber (Dreamcast)
Super Mario All-Stars (SNES)

[Six Switch]

So Joe will this include PC games too?

My pics for the list:
Gunstar Heroes(Genesis)
Halo(Xbox)
Unreal(Xbox)
Mario 3(NES)
Panzer Dragoon Saga(Saturn)

And one last thing Joe,we are not counting comps like Mario All Stars right? :hmm:

[scooterb23]

Baseball Stars - NES
Kaboom - 2600
Gunstar Heroes - Genesis
Super Mario Bros. 3 - NES
Mars Matrix - Dreamcast
Journey Escape - 2600 (you knew I had to put that in here ;) )
Super Monkey Ball 2 - Gamecube
Grim Fandango - PC
Archon - C64
Skaterock - C64 (hey, I liked it a lot...)

[le geek]

Lode Runner (C64, Apple II, others)
Times of Lore (C64, Amiga)
Space Taxi (C64)
Test Drive II: the duel (C64, Amiga, others)
Ultimate Wizard (C64)
Cannon Fodder (Amiga, others)
Lemmings (Amiga, others)
Prince of Persia (Apple II, Amiga, others)
Pinball Dreams (Amiga)
The Fool's Errand (Mac)

I have console favorites as well, but I thought I'd try to nominate some computer stuff :)

[Gunstarhero]

I wish we wouldn't pit PC and Console games on the same list, so I'm just putting down console titles here:

-Castlevania III:Dracula's Curse (NES)
-Super Castlevania IV (SNES)
-Tempest 2000 (Jaguar)
-Rush:2049 (N64)
-Metal Slug 3 (NEOGEO)
-Super Mario Bros. 3 (All-Stars version SNES)
-Super Mario World (SNES)
-Warlords (2600)
-Combat (2600)
-Super Punch-Out!!(SNES)

[Daniel Thomas]

Groovy stuff. I'm always a sucker for these kind of lists, and I'm really impressed with what everyone's throwing down. Right now, I'm going to list my personal 'Top Ten,' and later I'll highlight a few titles that might be getting overlooked.

1 - Zelda: Ocarina of Time
2 - Super Mario 64
3 - Tetris
4 - Ms. Pac-Man
5 - Super Mario (2D series)
6 - Super Bomberman 2
7 - Tony Hawk Pro Skater (series)
8 - Virtua Fighter (series)
9 - Panzer Dragoon Saga
10 - NiGHTS

Hope y'all like. I have to admit that I still haven't seen a lot of the current console games, like the new Mario, Zelda, and Metroid games on the 'Cube. Someone will vouch for the new stuff, anyway (way to mention Elite, Joe).

[portnoyd]

I won't list titles that don't stand a chance (BBBB comes to mind...), but here's my favorites in no particular order:

Legend of Zelda (NES)
Toe Jam & Earl (Genesis)
Landstalker (Genesis)
Pilotwings 64 (N64)
Final Fantasy II (SNES)
Secret of Mana (SNES)
Super Metroid (SNES)
Little Ninja Brothers (NES)
Metal Gear Solid (PSX)

That's sufficient for now.

dave

[DDCecil]

(I decided not to list any imports)

Ninja Gaiden 2 (NES)
Final Fantasy 2 (IV) (SNES)
Time Gal (Sega CD)
Secret of Mana (SNES)
Rygar (NES)
Ys Book 1 and 2 (TG-CD)
Parasol Stars (TG-16)
Final Fight (Sega CD)
TMNT IV (SNES)
Final Fantasy 3 (SNES)

[Mayhem]

The Sentinel (C64)
Impossible Mission (C64)
Wizball (C64)
Zelda: LttP (SNES)
Super Mario 4/World (SNES)
Super Mario Kart (SNES)
Zelda: OoT (N64)
Goldeneye (N64)
Metroid Prime (GC)
Advance Wars (GBA)

[jaydubnb]

Contra (NES)
Baseball Stars (NES)
Castlevania: SotN (PS1)
Metal Gear Solid (PS1)
Dracula X (PCE)
Lords of Thunder (Duo)
Axelay (SNES)
SF2: Turbo (SNES)
Gunstar Heroes (Gen)
Samurai Shdown 2 (N*G)

[digitalpress]

Keep 'em coming! I'll compile a list in the morning.

To answer a few questions posed so far:

-YES, PC games are fine to use.

-YES, these can be your "favorite games". You aren't just ANYONE, you know. The fact that you're here says you're a bit hardcore and more "in the know" than the average gamer, even if you don't think so.

The list might look a little disjointed at first but once we have the giant list in place we can start making cases for why certain games "belong" there and others do not. These are issues that certain other lists don't seem to debate.

[ubersaurus]

Starflight(genesis)
Galactic Attack(saturn)
Mr. Driller(dreamcast)
turmoil(2600)
robotron 2084(7800)
street fighter 2 turbo(snes)
beamrider(intv)
attack of the timelord!(o2)
Zillion(sms)
Vib Ribbon(PSX)
I think that'll do for now ;p

Edit-changed a few things

[bargora]

OK, here's stuff that I haven't seen up yet:

Yar's Revenge (Atari 2600)
Star Raider (Atari 8-bit)
Star Fleet I (Atari 8-bit, also available for PC)
Scorched Earth (PC)
Mechwarrior (PC)
Colony Wars (PSX)
X-Wing vs. Tie Fighter / Balance of Power (PC)

Stuff that others have posted that I would second includes:
Archon (C64)
Doom II (PC)
Adventure (Atari 2600)
Space Taxi (C64)
Advance Wars (GBA)
Warlords (Atari 2600)
Radiant Silvergun (Saturn)

Warlords and Radiant Silvergun are ports of arcade games, however, and I'm not sure whether that disqualifies them from the list. Other arcade ports I would include if permissible are:

R-Type (PSX)
Galactic Attack (Saturn)

[IntvGene]

Okay, I'm ready for seconds. I just want to make sure that some of these games get considered at least.

Rez (PS2)
Jet Set Radio
Paradroid (C64)
Populous (PC)
Alternate Reality: The Dungeon (C64)
M.U.L.E (C64)
River Raid
Dreadnaught Factor
Out of this world (PC / 3DO)
Wipeout
Star Control 2 (PC / 3DO)
One of the DDRs might get consideration, but don't ask me which one!

[TheRedEye]

1. Grim Fandango (Windows)
2. The Secret of Monkey Island (DOS)
3. LeChuck's Revenge: Monkey Island 2 (DOS)
4. Shenmue (Dreamcast)
5. River City Ransom (NES)
6. Phantasy Star IV (Genesis)
7. Sonic the Hedgehog 3/Sonic & Knuckles (Genesis)
8. Grand Theft Auto: Vice City (PS2)
9. Mr. Gimmick! (NES)
10. Space Quest IV (DOS)

[shai hulud]

in no order

1. Bubble Bobble (i think it plays and looks better for PSX actually)
2. Gunstar Heroes
3. Super Mario World
4. Zelda Link to the Past
5. Metal Slug 3
6. Samurai Shodown II
7. Final Fantasy III
8. Tetris Attack
9. NHL 94 (gen.)
10. Baseball Stars

[Sylentwulf]

I vomit at the thought of including PC games. That said:

Ultima Online
Everquest
Asherons Call 1
Final Fantasy 6
Final Fantasy 7
Dragon Warrior 4
Tetris - Gameboy original
Super Metroid
Madden 2003 (Sports are so hard because the next years version is ALWAYS better)
Sims

[Kid Ice]

This was already attempted before, and luckily I still have the top 100 list I did for that, so I'll just relist the top 10 from that list, taking the arcade games out:

Goldeneye N64
SMB3 NES
Space Invaders 2600
Street Fighter 2 SNES
Wipeout XL PSX
Gunstar Heroes GENESIS
Colony Wars PSX
Jet Grind Radio DREAMCAST
SMB64 N64
SMB1 NES

Keep in mind that at the time, there was a list to choose from, so here are a few favorites that would have made the list otherwise:

Radiant Silvergun SATURN
Demon Attack 2600
Doom PC

Also keep in mind that I'm keeping out my favorite arcade games, even ones that have stellar home versions. So no Robotron, Tempest, R-Type, Metal Slug, Ms. Pac Man, Galaga, etc.

the kid

[anagrama]

Totally off the top of my head (and without arcade conversions):

Hunter (Amiga)
Nights (Saturn)
Space Channel 5 (Dreamcast)
Gunstar Heroes (Megadrive)
Mario Kart (SNES)
Tempest 2000 (Jag)
Yoshi's Island (SNES)
PSO (Dreamcast)
Tetris Attack (SNES)

[Griking]

I'm posting my votes before I read the other responses. I'm sure I'll miss a few though. In no particular order;

Adventure - Atari 2600
Planetfall - Apple II
Ultima IV - Apple II
Diablo II (w/ Expansion) - PC
Unreal Tournament - PC
Daggerfall - PC
Wizardry: Proving Grounds of the Mad Overlord - Apple II

[Oobgarm]

Here are my top 10.

1. Contra (NES)
2. Shadowrun (SNES)
3. Gran Turismo 3 (PS2)
4. Secret of Mana (SNES)
5. Frequency (PS2)
6. Goldeneye 007 (N64)
7. Super Smash Bros. Melee (GCN)
8. Pilotwings (SNES)
9. Street Fighter 2 (SNES)
10. Shadowgate (NES)

[AB Positive]

Yar's revenge (2600)
Adventure (2600)
Phantasy Star IV (Genesis)
Legend of Zelda (NES)
Final Fantasy III (SNES)
King of Fighters '98 (Neo Geo)
Samurai Shodown 2 (Neo Geo)
Starflight (Genesis/Amiga)
Grim Fandango (PC)
Dark Wizard (Sega CD)

[Drexel923]

Not sure which ones I like better...so in no particular order:

Mario 3
Final Fantasy 3
Secret of Mana
Chrono Trigger
Zelda ALttP
Zelda Oot
Super Metroid
Metal Gear Solid
Castlevania: SOTN
Suikoden 2

More to come later.

[digitalpress]

UPDATED!

I'll keep the important update notes in the first post of this thread, since things will certainly get lost in the middle - like here.

[anagrama]

Bubble Bobble (NES/SMS/PSX)
Centipede (7800)
Double Dragon (Genesis)
Dragon's Lair (3DO/Jag CD/CD-i)
Final Fight (Sega CD)
Galaga (7800)
House of the Dead, The (DC)
Mars Matrix (DC)
Mr. Driller (DC)
Ms Pac-Man (7800)
NightWarriors: Darkstalkers' Revenge (Saturn)
Parasol Stars (TG-16)
Point Blank seires (PSX)
Radiant Silvergun (Saturn, Import)
Robotron: 2084 (7800)
Soul Caliber (Dreamcast)
Street Fighter Alpha 2 (PSX)
Street Fighter II (SNES)
Street Fighter II Turbo (SNES/3DO)
Virtua Fighter (series)


Arcade conversions are allowed then?
In that case, I'll add Rainbow Islands, Pang, Centipede, Qix and Super Streetfighter 2 Turbo to my list

Also Final Fantasy III/6 is a duplicate, as is Mario Kart/Super Mario Kart

[dreamcaster]

Stunt Race FX (SNES) is my favourite game of all time, so I hope it gets on the list!!!!

Other favourites:
Lylat Wars/StarFox 64 (N64)
Top Gear Rally (N64)
GoldenEye 007 (N64)
Mario Kart 64 (N64)
The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time (N64)
Perfect Dark (N64)
Re-Volt (N64) - also appeared on PC/PSX/DC
Conker's Bad Fur Day (N64)
Tetris DX (GBC)
Driver (GBC)
Mario Kart: Super Circuit (GBA)
Sega Rally Championship (Saturn)
Gran Turismo 3 A-Spec (PS2)
Super Smash Bros. Melee (GCN)
Solstice (NES)
Dr. Mario (NES)
Sega Rally 2 (Dreamcast)
Soul Calibur (Dreamcast)
Top Gear 3000 (SNES)
Super Mario All-Stars (SNES)

There's bound to be more, following a later edit however!

[Chunky]

i can't think this morning

Tetris (GB)
Bubble Bobble (NES)
Legend of Zelda (NES)
SMB (NES)
SMB 2 (NES)
Adventure(2600)
Zelda Link to the Past (SNES)
Demon Attack (2600)
Dragster (2600)
Baseball Stars (NES)
RC Pro-Am (NES)
Metroid (NES)
Devils Crush (TG-16)

[ghsqb]

:o
I have to say, that with the amount of replies I've seen, I'm very surprised to see that I'm the only one who has Lunar: SSS for Sega CD on their list.
Am I overrating this one?

[IntvGene]

DP: Just a few edits on the list. Can everyone agree that the best version of Pitfall II is the 5200 one? I mean, that whole extra level... Jet Set Radio is listed under the Xbox. I know I nominated the DC version, but just HATE the name Jet Grind Radio. I didn't mean the Xbox version--that's Jet Set Radio Future. Not as an edit, but I laughed when you put Ultima IV as the Apple II version, nice to get some variety.

As for others:
Little Computer People (C64)
Slime World (Lynx)
Skool Daze (C64)
Return Fire (3DO)
Crystal Castles (2600)
Warlords (2600)
Fortune Builder (Coleco)
Missile Command (2600)
Civilization (PC)
Wasteland (C64)

[Drexel923]

Here's some more:

Marvel vs Capcom 2 (DC)
F-Zero (SNES)
Lunar 2: EB (Sega CD/PSX)

[digitalpress]

Thank ya partner!

I'm making more changes and updates now. I think with regards to "which system" we should leave it open to any system the game was produced for - People will remember Pitfall II for 2600 and ColecoVision and may not have ever played the 5200 or 8-bit version... and yet it should STILL qualify as a great game.

We're at 251 games.

[Drexel923]

You have Street Fight 2 Turbo on there twice. Also here's some game I think you can remove"

Street Fight 2...since we have turbo
Mario Party 4...the original is still the best IMO
Pilotwings 64...the original is better
Super Mario All Stars...should we have this plus two of the original games on the list
Mario Kart Series...pick one, I think the SNES one is the best.
Frequency...good game but not top 100

[Scoots]

Lose Ninja Gaiden 2.

Add Paperboy (Arcade), Marble Madness (Arcade/NES/Genesis) and Gauntlet (Arcade/NES).

[Tony Uniopolis]

In no particular order:

Baseball Stars (NES)
Turmoil (2600)
Half-Life (PC & Dreamcast)
Blood (PC)
Diablo II w/expansion (PC)
Spy Hunter (Colecovision)
Kaboom! (2600)
The Sims (PC & Gamecube)
San Francisco Rush 2049 (Dreamcast)
Mars Matrix (Dreamcast)

Just tried to pick the games that I have spent the most time with over the years.....sure I missed (quite) a few!

[Arcade Antics]

250? I propose the following games get the axe (first quick pass-through):

Arkanoid (NES) - It's good, but top 100? Not sure...
Banjo Kazooie (N64) - IMO, not Top 100 material
Deluxe Galaga (Amiga) - Good game, but IMO, not Top 100 material.
Driver (GBC) - IMO, not Top 100 material.
Galaga (7800) - Too slow, good, but not Top 100 good.
Goonies II, The (NES) - IMO, not Top 100 material.
Jordan vs Bird (800) Good game, but IMO, not Top 100 material.
Journey Escape (2600) Just. No. :)
Little Ninja Brothers (NES) - IMO, not Top 100 material.
Mario Party 4 (Gamecube) Not Top 100 material.
Ms Pac-Man (7800) I'd rather see a different port of this one here - NES, Genesis, etc.
Night Trap (Sega CD) - IMO, not Top 100 material. Good, not great.
Pole Position (2600) - IMO, good but not Top 100 material.
Robotron: 2084 (7800) - Robotron is the best. game. ever., but IMO this port is weak/slow.
Space Channel 5 (Dreamcast) - I like the game, but IMO, it's not Top 100 material.
Street Fighter II (SNES) - IMO SSFIITurbo is better, should keep one and drop the others for SNES.
Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles IV (SNES) - IMO not Top 100.
Test Drive II: the duel (C64, Amiga, others)
Tetris Attack (SNES) - IMO not Top 100.
Tetris DX (GBC) - IMO not Top 100.
Turmoil (2600) - Good game, but IMO not Top 100.

And a minor tweak to the list: House of the Dead, The (DC) - Should be HOTD2. :)

[Kroogah]

Hmm...looks like I'm a bit too late to add anything, so I'll offer what I think should be subtracted.

KEEP TETRIS ATTACK ON THE LIST! ^_^

Super SF2 TURBO never came out on the SNES...SF Alpha 3 and SF Collection should be the only Street Fighters on this list.

I think ya should remove these:

Diablo
Double Dragon (Genesis) (replace with NES version)
Dragster (2600)
Goonies II, The (NES)
Journey Escape (2600)
Landstalker (Genesis)
Little Ninja Brothers (NES)
Mario Kart: Super Circuit (GBA)
Mario Party 4 (Gamecube)
Metal Slug 3 (Neo-Geo)
Night Trap (Sega CD)
Pilotwings (SNES)
Pilotwings 64 (N64)
Rush:2049 (N64)
Rygar (NES)
Sonic the Hedgehog (Genesis) (Sonic CD is better)
Space Channel 5 (Dreamcast)
Star Tropics (NES)
Streets of Rage (Genesis) (2 was better)
Super Mario Bros. (NES) (if you're including Mario All Stars, leave this off the list)
Super Mario Bros. 3 (NES) (ditto)
Tetris DX (GBC)
Time Gal (Sega CD)
UN Squadron (SNES)
Wonder Boy III: The Dragon's Trap (SMS)
Zillion (SMS)

[anagrama]

250? I propose the following games get the axe (first quick pass-through):

Space Channel 5 (Dreamcast)


:bad-words:

[ManekiNeko]

Arcade Antics, you hardly explained why those games should be removed from the top 100 list. "In my opinion" isn't sufficient justification, and is your viewpoints are pretty subjective. I say let's put it to a vote once a preliminary list is compiled. It'll be much more fair that way.

JR

[Kid Fenris]

This won't be pretty, but I suggest that we bump off the following games. I'm not going to bother with explaining why these games should be dropped, since it's best if everyone just posts their lists, with the votes for each game being tallied from our suggestions.

APB (Lynx)
Alternate Reality: The Dungeon (C64)
Banjo Kazooie (N64)
Beamrider (INTV/5200)
Blades of Vengeance (GEN)
Bomberman Party Edition (PSX)
Cannon Fodder (Amiga, others)
Colony Wars (PSX)
Deluxe Galaga (Amiga)
Diablo
Doom (PC)
Double Dragon (Genesis)
Dragster (2600)
Dr. Mario (NES)
Final Fight (Sega CD)
Goonies II, The (NES)
Immortal, The (Genesis)
Impossible Mission (C64)
Incredible Wizard, The (Bally Astrocade)
Jordan vs Bird (800)
Journey Escape (2600)
Little Ninja Brothers (NES)
Mars Matrix (DC)
Metal Slug (Neo-Geo)
Mario Kart 64 (N64)
Mario Kart: Super Circuit (GBA)
Mario Party (N64)
Mr. Gimmick! (NES)
Night Trap (Sega CD)
Pang/Buster Bros. (PSX)
Pilotwings (SNES)
Pilotwings 64 (N64)
Pokemon Puzzle League (Nintendo 64)
Pole Position (2600)
Parasol Stars (TG-16)
Perfect Dark (N64)
Raiden (Jaguar)
RC Pro-Am (NES)
Re-Volt (N64/PC/PSX/DC)
Shadowrun (SNES)
Shining Force (Genesis)
Skaterock (C64)
Skool Daze (C64)
Sonic & Knuckles (Genesis)
Sonic the Hedgehog 3 (Genesis)
Space Channel 5 (Dreamcast)
Star Tropics (NES)
StarFox 64 (N64)
Super Castlevania IV (SNES)
Tetris DX (GBC)
Time Gal (Sega CD)
Top Gear 3000 (SNES)
Ultimate Wizard (C64)
UN Squadron (SNES)
Wipeout XL (PSX)

I also propose that we replace the following:

Contra (NES) (Replace this with the far superior Contra III: The Alien Wars)
Dark Wizard (Sega CD) (Dragon Force for the Saturn is similar, but much more enjoyable.)
Lunar: Silver Star Story (Sega CD) (Lunar 2: Eternal Blue is better)
Street Fighter Alpha 2 (PSX) (Change this to the Saturn version)
Streets of Rage (Genesis) (Yashiro's right -SoR 2 is better)

Tetris Attack, Wonder Boy III, Metal Slug 3, Ninja Gaiden II, and Rygar should stay. And though it may be too late, I suggest that we add these:

Crystalis (NES)
MUSHA (Genesis)
R-Type (PSX)
Snatcher (Sega CD)
Terranigma (SNES, Euro Release)
Vagrant Story (PSX)

Edit: I have two questions.

1) Should we exclude games released within the past year or so? It would give us more space to work with. And if we do include recent stuff, we've got to get Metroid Fusion (GBA) on the list. Please.

2) Can we list a series in only one spot? If so, we could just group all of the Final Fantasy, Street Fighter, and Phantasy Star games under a single space for each franchise.

[Arcade Antics]

Arcade Antics, you hardly explained why those games should be removed from the top 100 list. "In my opinion" isn't sufficient justification, and is your viewpoints are pretty subjective. I say let's put it to a vote once a preliminary list is compiled. It'll be much more fair that way.

Exactly - it's not justification at all, just what I was proposing in lieu of the fact that we're already way over the mark. It's *already* to a vote - these are games I'm voting for to be removed, not games I'm saying should *definitely* be removed. :) The list is an evolving work in progress.

@anagrama: I LIKE Space Channel 5, I just don't think it's a Top 100 of All Time game, that's all. I know too many people who HATE it, but I'm a SC5 FAN. :)

[TheRedEye]

I'd omit these:


Advance Wars (GBA)
Arkanoid (NES)
Banjo Kazooie (N64)
Conker's Bad Fur Day (N64)
Doom (PC)
Doom II (PC)
(have these really stood the test of time?)
House of the Dead, The (DC)
Kid Icarus (NES)
King's Quest (PC)
(the first one? really??)
Legend of Zelda: Oracle Series (Game Boy Color)
Little Ninja Brothers (NES)
Mario Party 4 (Gamecube)
Metal Slug (can we group these as a series?)
Mr. Gimmick! (NES)
(I think the game deserves to be here, but I doubt many will agree)
Night Trap (Sega CD)
(oh COME ON)
Parasol Stars (TG-16)
Pilotwings 64 (N64)
Pole Position (2600)
Pole Position II (7800)
Rainbow Islands (NES/PSX)
Sonic (group as a series?)
Space Quest IV (DOS)
(a personal favorite, but I don't see this getting many votes)
Star Tropics (NES)
StarFox 64 (N64)
Streets of Rage (Genesis)
(better than part 2??)
Super Castlevania IV (SNES)
Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles IV (SNES)

I consider almost all of these to be great games, but I don't know that they'd be top 100 of all time material.

[ubersaurus]

I say remove Metroid 1. I'm sorry, but for as innovative as it was for the time, it has not aged well, and cannot stand up to the other games in the series, or even similar contemporaries (like zillion). The whole thing where you started with only 30 points of health every time you put in a password was crummy, and quite frankly, Super Metroid did everything it did, and did it better.

Same story with Super Mario World. To me, it was just a weaker version of Mario 3. Sure, it looked prettier, but it played so similar, and yet had alot of the neat features of 3 gone.

And why is mario all stars on there? It's just a compilation. And if we already have most of the games in its lineup on the list, why bother?

[Achika]

Take off these:

Banjo Kazooie (N64)
Frequency (PS2)
Grand Theft Auto: Vice City (PS2)
Metal Slug 3 (Neo-Geo)
Metal Slug X (Neo-Geo)
Perfect Dark (N64)
Pilotwings 64 (N64)
Super Mario All-Stars (SNES)
Super Mario Bros. (NES)
Super Mario Sunshine (Gamecube)
Yoshi's Island (SNES)

If Virtua Fighter is going to be grouped as a series, there are several others on here too that should be (Metal Slug, Mario Party, Mario Kart series, Doom, Diablo, Monkey Island, Sega Rally, Zelda, etc. --sure not ALL parts of the series are on this list, but close enough?)

Possible replacement of SS2 with SS3?

If SC5 comes off the list, I'll cry. :(

[Gunstarhero]

Don't hate me. These are the games I vote to be removed, nothing personal here.


Advance Wars (GBA)
Attack of the Timelord(O2)
Asherons Call (PC)
Banjo Kazooie (N64)
Blades of Vengeance (GEN)
Boulder Dash II (C64)
Civilization (PC)
Conkers Bad Game (N64)
Daggerfall (PC)
Dark Wizard (SCD)
Deluxe Galaga (amiga)
Diablo
Diablo II
Driver (GBC)
Dune II (PC)
Elite (C64)
Everquest (PC)
Fool's Errand, The (MAC)
Frequency (PS2)
Grim Fandango (PC)
Half-Life (PC)
Hunter (amiga)
Jordan vs. Bird(800)
Journey Escape (2600)
Kings Quest (PC)
Little Computer People (C64)
Madden 2003(sports franchises will be outdated from this list very soon so why bother?)
Mario Kart:Super Circuit (GBA)
Mechwarrior (PC)
Mario Party 4 (GC)
Mr. Gimmick (NES)
Ms.Pac-Man (7800) theres a better version, like PSX Namco Museum.
NHL 94 (GEN)
Out of this World (PC)
Paradroid (C64)
Phantasy Star 4(GEN)
Pilotwings 64(N64)
Pole Position (2600)
Raiden (Jaguar) --replace with Raiden Project for PSX
Re-Volt
Secret of Monkey Island (PC)
Sentinel (C64)
Sim City 2000 (PC)
Space Channel 5(DC)
Star Control(PC)
Super Mario All Stars(SNES)--either make this represent all 3 NES marios, or delete it.
Top Gear Rally (N64)
Top Gear 3000 (SNES)
Ultima Online (PC)
Unreal (Xbox)
Unreal Tourn. (PC)

[ubersaurus]

A few further rants...

First, if you want mario all stars, why not take off mario 1, mario 3, and mario world, and list the all stars+world compilation? Saves room.

2nd, sonic 3 and sonic & knuckles, on their own were kinda weak. Together, though, they rocked. So I say remove em both and replace with their counterpart, Sonic 3 & Knuckles. Also Take out Sonic 1 for Sonic 2-2 was FAR superior.

3rd, why tetris attack and Pokemon Puzzle League? They're the same game. One or the other, says I. Ditto with Tetris and Tetris DX.

4th, the original SF2 was pretty weak. I say take it off, as well as one of the two between SF2 Turbo and Super Turbo. Both of those are great, but we don't need em both on there. Also, ST didn't come out on SNES-it was on 3do & dreamcast, and the SF collection for saturn/PSX.

Ditto with removing Metal Slug X and 3...1 was more fun, and they all play damn near the same anyhow. I can't agree with the taking of Perfect Dark though...that was a damn good FPS. I also gotta defend SC5. It was a fun game, the presentation was great, the music was great, and it was hard.

[shai hulud]

i would cry the least if these games were killed (i am only nominating games i have played for removal)

Adventure
Advance Wars
Archon
Arkanoid (the snes version was better anyway)
Asherons Call
Axelay (there were better snes shooters)
Banjo Kazooie
Conkers
Daggerfall
Dark Wizard
Dragster
Driver
Final Fight
Goonies II
GTA Vice City
Immortal
Intelligent Cube
Little Ninja Bros.
Metal Slug X
Night Trap
Perfect Dark
Pokemon Puzzle ( i hate pokemon, love tetris KEEP TETRIS ATTACK)
Raiden
Rush 2049
Star Fox 64
Super Mario Bros 1, 2, 3 (keep super mario all stars)
Super Mario 64
Top Gear Rally
Valkyrie Profile

[IntvGene]

Yeesh!

Seeing people with 70 titles to remove from the list is pretty scary. I mean, I am not going to complain about single titles (yet :)), but let's make sure that you've at least played a title that you are removing. Just because you don't like it, or never heard of it, it doesn't necessarily mean it shouldn't stay.

The series issue does need addresssing. I am kinda ambivalent. On one hand, I agree, but on the other I think that some of the series have changed quite a bit, and it's a bit of a cop out to say the best game of all time is ________ Series.

I would also like to see what we are defining as a Top 100 game. What are we looking for originality, ahead of its time, fun, interesting...? I don't think we will get a very good list if it is just my favorite games. A collection of favorite games does not make a good Top 100 list.

[Gunstarhero]

I wouldn't get too upset over people(like me) who have put down a ton of games on their remove lists. I think the important thing first off is to get this monstrosity of a list(thanks to PC games, blechh) down to a reasonable amount of games, to where we can begin to argue coherently the finer points. We certainly can't argue points on what could become a 500 game rough draft, that would be a mess. I say everyone put down every game they feel doesn't belong on this list, it won't hurt anything. Just because it gets voted by someone to be removed doesn't mean it will happen. But we must face that since the list is to be 100 games in the end, and its already up to 250 games, the MAJORITY of the games are going to get zapped.

This should be interesting once a smaller list is compiled and DP begins to ask for real reasons for games to stay on the list.

[AB Positive]

Nothing personal here, but here is what I'd remove:

Alternate Reality: The Dungeon (C64)
APB (Lynx)
Archon (C64/Atari 8-bit)
Arkanoid (NES)
Asheron's Call (PC)
Banjo Kazooie (N64)
Beamrider (INTV/5200)
Bomberman Party Edition (PSX)
Cannon Fodder (Amiga, others)
Castlevania III: Dracula's Curse (NES) (Or, replace with the more superior Castlevania II)
Civilization (PC/PSX)
Colony Wars (PSX)
Daggerfall (PC)
Demon Attack (2600)
Diablo
Diablo II w/ Expansion (PC) (while i love both, I don't see them as top 100 material)
Doom II (PC)
Dr. Mario (NES)
Dragster (2600)
Driver (GBC)
Dune II (PC)
Elite (C64)
EverQuest (PC)
Final Fantasy II (SNES) (3/6 and 7 represent the series well. if you want a third FF game in there, use the original)
Fool's Errand, The (Mac)
Fortune Builder (ColecoVision)
Frequency (PS2)
Gran Turismo 3 (PS2)
Grand Theft Auto III (PS2)
Grand Theft Auto: Vice City (PS2) (ok, this is personal. I hate hate HATE the GTA series. couldn't stand playing more than twenty minutes of it)
Jordan vs Bird (800)
Legend of Zelda, The: Ocarina of Time (N64)
Legend of Zelda: Oracle Series (Game Boy Color) (the first two games represent the series better)
Lunar: Silver Star Story (Sega CD) (I agree to replace this with Eternal Blue)
Madden 2003 (PS2/GCN/Xbox)
Mario Kart: Super Circuit (GBA)
Mario Party (N64)
Metal Slug 3 (Neo-Geo)
Metal Slug X (Neo-Geo)
Night Trap (Sega CD)
Pokemon Puzzle League (Nintendo 64)
Rush:2049 (N64)
Skaterock (C64)
Skool Daze (C64)
Sonic & Knuckles (Genesis)
Sonic the Hedgehog 3 (Genesis)
Street Fighter Alpha 2 (PSX)
Street Fighter II (SNES)
Street Fighter II Turbo (SNES/3DO) (Super Street Fighter 2, arguably the best home port ever is already on the list)
Super Mario All-Stars (SNES)
Super Mario Sunshine (Gamecube)
Super Mario World 64 (N64)
Tetris DX (GBC)
Time Gal (Sega CD)
Top Gear 3000 (SNES)
Top Gear Rally (N64)
Turmoil (2600)
Ultima Online (PC)
Unreal (Xbox)
Unreal Tournament (PC)



I might have culled -too- much, but these games are either quite bad in my opinion, represented by a better game in the series, or just not quite good enough to make the list.


And, if I can argue one game that made the lists of other people, KEEP LANDSTALKER!!! It was a great great game, even if it's sequel was awful on the Dreamcast.

-AG

[TheRedEye]

Don't hate me. These are the games I vote to be removed, nothing personal here.


Grim Fandango (PC)
Secret of Monkey Island (PC)


I'd be interested in hearing your experiences with these games, followed by an explanation of why 100 games are better than them. I know it's "nothing personal," but not including Grim Fandango, what I consider the Citizen Kane of video games, on a TOP ONE HUNDRED list makes absolutely no sense to me. The artistry of that game has yet to be even remotely touched...everything about it was a labor of love done beautifully.

And Achika: I disagree with grouping Monkey Island. Ron Gilbert did an amazing, personal job with the first two games. The second two were done by outside sources years later who had nothing to do with the original games, and it shows. They're terrible. I'd approve grouping the first two, as they're very similar and were only about a year apart, but I will NOT cast my vote for 3 or 4.

[Gunstarhero]

TheRedEye wrote:

I'd be interested in hearing your experiences with these games, followed by an explanation of why 100 games are better than them. I know it's "nothing personal," but not including Grim Fandango, what I consider the Citizen Kane of video games, on a TOP ONE HUNDRED list makes absolutely no sense to me. The artistry of that game has yet to be even remotely touched...everything about it was a labor of love done beautifully.


Go easy man, I'm glad its your favorite. But you said it, a TOP ONE HUNDRED list. 100 games isn't very much, I could name 200 Console games I would rather see on this list than any PC game mentioned here, except for maybe Doom. Its a top 100 EVER list, and I personally don't want many PC games on here. That doesn't mean they won't be here, I'm just one person. I'll admit, I've never played Grim Fandango, but I'm not required to say why it should go, I think the more important factor in the coming days will be for people like you, who love the game, to make the case on why it should absolutely STAY on the list. I'm going to try my best to keep some of my selections on this list, but I'm not going to demand explanations from people who want them gone, I'll just do my best to prove their better than X game. If they stay, then OK, if not, Oh well. People have their own reasons for wanting games gone, whatever that reason is doesn't matter, there is always method to the madness :-D

[portnoyd]

I must say I'm sad to see Little Ninja Bros Pilotwings 64 get the axe by everybody. Oh well.

But I will fight my damn head off to keep Landstalker on that list. It's the Genesis Zelda goddamnit.

Secret of Monkey Island has to be a contender, at the very least.

I'd suggest games to axe, but I think I'll play devil's advocate for games to keep that have been mentioned for the boot.

You guys should really try Mr Gimmick for the NES before passing on it. Seriously.

Dr. Mario. Superior puzzle game. Keep this instead of Pokemon Puzzle League.

I'd say have Mario Kart 64 on the list instead of Mario Kart SNES. IMO, 4 player made the game better.

Aaaand I'd leave on Daggerfall. Personal preference. Finally, lump Madden as a series and keep it.

dave

[Achika]

I'd approve grouping the first two, as they're very similar and were only about a year apart

I can agree with that, since they were re-released on the same CD a few years ago. (3 was also in the pack, but on a different CD! HA!)

[portnoyd]

I'd approve grouping the first two, as they're very similar and were only about a year apart

I can agree with that, since they were re-released on the same CD a few years ago. (3 was also in the pack, but on a different CD! HA!)

And I enjoyed Monkey Island #3. Not as much as 1 or 2, but it wasn't THAT bad.

dave

[scooterb23]

Journey Escape (2600) Just. No.

Somehow, I don't think that my favorite 2600 game of all time will make the final top 100 :( ;)

[digdug]

If I can give a suggestion if I may, Why not ask for everyones top 100 and compile a list of who has what and then determine each games rank based on how many times they have been voted upon? Instead of asking for which games people would axe. Give a time period for people to have there votes in by and then post the results with a tally of how many votes each game received? Including the ones that do not make the top 100, and how many votes they each received?


Just a suggestion. To make the process easier.

Dig Dug

[kevates]

Please add these to the list:

Poy Poy (PS1)
Warlords (2600)
Guitar Freaks (PS1-- Import)
Gauntlet Legends (N64)
You Don't Know Jack (PS1 or PC)
H.E.R.O. (2600)
Crazy Taxi 2 (Dreamcast)
Jumpman (C64)
Tetris (Gameboy)
Frogger (Genesis)

[Gunstarhero]

If I can give a suggestion if I may, Why not ask for everyones top 100 and compile a list of who has what and then determine each games rank based on how many times they have been voted upon? Instead of asking for which games people would axe. Give a time period for people to have there votes in by and then post the results with a tally of how many votes each game received? Including the ones that do not make the top 100, and how many votes they each received?


Just a suggestion. To make the process easier.

Dig Dug

That is a damn fine idea. I second this.