Biggest failure of a console [Archive] - Page 3

camarotuner

06-15-2010, 11:43 PM

Guys it was a *business* argument. I rip at the 360 because from a business standpoint it has been a terrible misfire from MS and wall street seems to agree with me on this. Bloomberg's just wrote an article ripping the company a new one over their entertainment division and a lot are now viewing it as a liability. Their stock is down almost 20 dollars year to date. It's now valued at less than Sony's. Ultimately business failures are about MONEY. No system on this list has cost a company more money than the 360 has cost Microsoft. In the end, that's all that really matters if we are arguing failed systems.

But it's turned into a fanboy argument. You guys have fun with that. I'm out. If anyone who was doing the fun back and forth debate about the business aspects wants to continue, PM me, the counter-argument using the Genesis is interesting.

Arkhan

06-16-2010, 01:14 AM

wow really? there are still people here who thing the ps3 is a better *game* console? i mean its fighting really hard TODAY to even compete w/ the 360, but a year or two ago? man the 360 was just decimating sony. hell i doubt sony will ever surpass MS in this generation. we'll see though.

this is is coming from a guy who has both consoles, and is a complete ps1 fanboy. i dont hate sony by any means, hell i own 3 psps with like 90 games!

To me it is a better game console. The games I like are all there. Where is Metal Gear Solid and Time Crisis for 360?

FF13 was better on PS3. Folklore? Street Fighter on anything but a sony machine these days is lolsauce.

heavenly sword, dantes inferno, etc. etc.

I don't see the problem. Alot of peoples love for the 360 stems from the Live content and the stupid gamerscore and achievements BS that allows them to interact with the "community" full of yelling goons and pissy 12 year olds. Online multiplayer gaming's ground wasn't really broken by the 360. That concept has been in full swing since the glory days of PC gaming... and at least on the PC you dont have to HEAR the idiots.

Like I said, I sold my 360 years ago because I played/beat 2 games on it and then got bored. There are enough exclusives on the ps3 to warrant a purchase now, and more to come even. If there are enough games that the combined cost is > system cost, it's doing fine.

What does the 360 have that really sets it apart other than mass-pleasing shooters/empty action games, and games that are also on PC or PS3?

I guess if my computer didn't run the same games, better, I would have more love for the 360.

and maybe if I loved waving my e-dick around with a gamerscore card.

Everything the 360 fans praise the 360 for is alot of "been there, done that".

at least my computer doesn't RROD.

that being said, I am buying a 360 again. There are finally some games that I'd like to play, and I might as well dick off with XNA programming again while I am at it.

BHvrd

06-16-2010, 01:21 AM

ConsoleAddict

06-16-2010, 11:03 AM

These items aren't consoles, they are handhelds. However, you wonder how the inferior Game Boy was able to trounce both the Atari Lynx and the Sega Game Gear for so many years.

Granted, both handhelds may have been hurt by the lack of games vs. the Game Boy as well as their higher prices but why were people content to play green and black games that were sometimes difficult to see over the more superior consoles?

At least Sega tried hard to get people to see the light with their commercials. It seemed like the Game Gear was on the verge of eating away at Nintendo's handheld market share but it never happened. I'm vexed on how the Game Gear wasn't more successful.

Aswald

06-16-2010, 01:08 PM

The Neo-Geo was mentioned here earlier, but isn't that an unusual situation? From what I can tell, wasn't the "home console" simply the arcade machine without all of the fancy hardware? This was why home versions were the same as arcade versions- the game itself was the same?

This made it very expensive, but it was aimed at a niche market- those who had the many hundreds to spend for the games (if not thousands).

Given this, wouldn't the only question be not so much numbers sold- it was probably one of the least-numerous home consoles sold because of the price- but whether or not it, in the arcade and home formats, made the company money?

Did it, by the way?

Coptur

06-16-2010, 02:55 PM

Personally, I couldn't stand the N64. The polygon style graphics look like vomit.

Arkhan

06-16-2010, 06:22 PM

Personally, I couldn't stand the N64. The polygon style graphics look like vomit.

they mimic the shape of the controller. :D

Rob2600

06-16-2010, 07:08 PM

Personally, I couldn't stand the N64. The polygon style graphics look like vomit.

Many N64 games - like Conker's Bad Fur Day, Wave Race 64, Mortal Kombat 4, and Rayman 2 - still look very good today.

Poofta!

06-16-2010, 07:55 PM

Your individual experience doesn't mean it doesn't happen. I owned a 360 for a little over a year and a half and went through four systems. Does that make me think all of them broke? No, but it's pretty clear from reports online the system has a high failure rate. And you're making a very ignorant statement to think that it's some small vocal minority. It doesn't mean the system is a failure, but when that can retract from sales from people who consider the risk too high - you have a problem.

actually im agreeing with you. experience varies. i simply stated mine. i am not ignorant to the failure rate (and neither is microsoft - they extended the warranty twice, and pretty much everyone can get their RRoD fixed for free).

Further more, why are discounting the Xbox Live price? You might be able to find a year subscription for $35 if you're a smart shopper, hell if you wanted you easily pull off never paying if you simply took advantage of the many ways to get free month cards, but that doesn't take away from the fact that 95% of the time you walk into a brick and mortar store the price is $50.

B&M stores are important, of course, but how many people, gamers, use the internet? especially a demographic as hardcore as teh 360's. do you think these people never heard of amazon.com? c'mon. fact is, online the sub is 35$, its simple and easy to find.

The Wii isn't competing with the PS3 or 360? People still feed into that bullshit? What is Kinect and Move? They are attempts to capitalize and compete on the Wii's market. When internal funds are moved to focus on these products it goes to show that yes they are competing and in fact they got man handled by Nintendo because the market changed and they didn't adapt accordingly.

the wii ISNT competing w/ 360/ps3... the 360/ps3 are beginning to try to compete with the the wii. they feel (properly) that since such a large amount of people have both (a wii and a ps3/360), why not have people just own their system, if they can provide a wii-like experience? i dont see nintendo coming out with a GoW (gear or god!) and halo/killzone clones and boosting their graphic horsepower...

Furthermore, since when is the 360 such a huge cash cow? The entire Xbox brand hasn't been profitable until (finally) the past year or two. Although that has been Microsoft's choice in order to penetrate the market that doesn't necessarily make the system an undeniable success. Is it a failure? Not even close. I'm not arguing that, but I've read this thread and you clearly have a biased opinion on the matter, not to mention posts filled with inaccurate information.

well the 360 has hardware problems (rrod) that prevented it from being profitable from day one. if it wasnt for that, the 360 would been profitable from day 1. MS rushed the console to market and it paid off (even with all the replacements)

Stop taking people's opinions personally and acting like a child.

now now, that was unnecessary. dont be a jerk ;)

im not biased, i buy every good ps3 exclusive and enjoy it as much as every 360 one. the 360 simply has a better community online, which to me, means a lot, so obviously i will prefer it over the ps3.

Poofta!

06-16-2010, 07:57 PM

@ Poofta

You may not be a teenager but you sure type like one. Honestly, what adult types everything in lower-case? Or are you 12?

its faster. ive been typing like this for years. last time i checked im not at work and no longer in school. why cant i relax and just type? id rather keep it uniform lower case than miss a punctuation mark or capital and make it look even worse.

Small portion of it's games are download only, mainly indie games. Plus the other current gen systems all have it as well.

plus, these games are games that otherwise would never see a console release.

mass-pleasing

thats all it takes.

i wont start listing games because its silly. if you cant find a great exclusive game on the 360, or a multiplatform game thats better on the 360, im just at awe.

Enigmus

06-16-2010, 09:30 PM

Personally, I couldn't stand the N64. The polygon style graphics look like vomit.

Well, if you don't like smooth Pentium II-based N64 polygons, enjoy your jagged-lined, load timing, 39 Mhz, unexpandable 2 MB Playstation.

Jorpho

06-17-2010, 12:12 AM

its faster. ive been typing like this for years. last time i checked im not at work and no longer in school. why cant i relax and just type? id rather keep it uniform lower case than miss a punctuation mark or capital and make it look even worse.If you still care enough that you don't want it to look even worse, then clearly it does not matter that you are not at work and no longer in school. Also, if you're not at work and no longer in school and just trying to relax, what are you in such a hurry for?

dnehthend

06-17-2010, 03:12 AM

...ps2 hype killed the dreamcast

neo geo pocket color, huge failure, poor ad campaign, I don't remember seeing any ads for it... I probably did, not a good thing that I can't remember a single one

zodiac tapwave, the common person has never even heard of it, plus the games had a ridiculous system to buying/storing unless you bought the game on an sd card

ngage, poorly executed everything

dnehthend

06-17-2010, 03:14 AM

Well, if you don't like smooth Pentium II-based N64 polygons, enjoy your jagged-lined, load timing, 39 Mhz, unexpandable 2 MB Playstation.

my favorite thing about 3d playstation games is how the walls never move and jump around

tomaitheous

06-17-2010, 11:48 AM

If you still care enough that you don't want it to look even worse, then clearly it does not matter that you are not at work and no longer in school. Also, if you're not at work and no longer in school and just trying to relax, what are you in such a hurry for?

Haha, no doubt. And how hard is it to capitalize, anyway? I call bullshit.

physics223

06-18-2010, 10:22 AM

Arkhan

06-18-2010, 08:13 PM

Haha, no doubt. And how hard is it to capitalize, anyway? I call bullshit.

This, coming from the guy that sometimes makes lengthy posts full of typos, improper capitalization, wrong use of homonyms, and broken sentences. How hard is it to proofread, anyway?

makes someone else's consistent lack of capitalization seem like a minor offense to me. Especially since they admitted they are aware of it.

:)

:dance:

That being said, what is the point of hassling someone all pedantically on the internets, especially in regards to someones age? ffs. It doesn't further the discussion at all.

*ahem*

Well, if you don't like smooth Pentium II-based N64 polygons, enjoy your jagged-lined, load timing, 39 Mhz, unexpandable 2 MB Playstation.

yeah but we got nice FMVs, longer games, more detailed games, and better audio!

:D

Where was the N64's Star Ocean 2?

"PLEASE INSERT CARTRIDGE 2" wouldn't have worked out so good, haha

Enigmus

06-18-2010, 08:45 PM

yeah but we got nice FMVs, longer games, more detailed games, and better audio!

:D

Where was the N64's Star Ocean 2?

"PLEASE INSERT CARTRIDGE 2" wouldn't have worked out so good, haha

Sorry if that sounded snarky, but I grew up with the N64, so I guess favoritism-backlash got off its chain again.

Still, they both seem to have their high points. PSX has its CD-based storage, more room on CD for files, higher quality audio and easier to use memory cards, but N64 was also good because it had higher resolution, the Expansion Pak, its 100 Mhz NEC chip (which is on par with a Pentium II,) more durable game storage in the form of cartridges, and it being ahead of Sony with its built-in thumbstick.

So, IMO, they're both very good and respectable systems.

Now Saturn, on the other hand, that's a different story.

Lack of third-party support, Sega's bad reputation, confusing coding due to the way the CPUs were set up, and its reuse of the same controller as Mega Drive but with shoulder triggers basically sent Sega on a Titanic course, which lead to Dreamcast failing, in part due to the Hype Machine pulling in its usual crowd of idiots with the PS2.

So, yeah, no game system is ever perfect. It's all a matter of opinion.

EDIT: N64 games are actually more visually stunning, it's just because of the filter used in the N64. Flipping this off in Project 64 shows how stunning some of the N64 games can really get.

Also, the PSX and N64 both have problems with rendering- some PSX games have bad pop-up for texturing and 3D modeling, and the N64 occasionally has problems where models can get warped or objects can easily obscure the camera.

Arkhan

06-18-2010, 08:52 PM

Snarky? lol. wasn't snarky to me!

its all in good fun :)

I had an N64 growing up, but the severe lack of RPGs made me barely touch the thing.

4 player goldeneye on a 13" TV bitd was tight as fuck though!

migo

06-19-2010, 12:15 AM

NGPC?

It never got a real chance to go. It was destroyed by the GBA and its death killed SNK America and brought SNK to its knees in Japan. SNK did come back, but once aquired by Playmore it was never the same.

I'd argue if anything it's the NGP. If they were able to put out a colour handheld a year later with 40 hours of battery life on 2 AAs, it showed some lack of foresight that they didn't launch one right away. And as has been shown many times, killing a product so shortly after it's launched to replace it with another one isn't a good way to ensure fan support. Had the NGP launched with colour to begin with, the GameBoy Color wouldn't have stolen the thunder and it would have been perceived as Nintendo playing catch up because the NGP was a real threat rather than SNK playing catch up.

The Dreamcast wasn't a Sega Killer, the poor support/cost of a Sega CD, 32X and Saturn that all fell so quickly painted Sega into a corner. The Dreamcast when it launched was already facing the 'Sega is going to screw you over' rumors. Because of that, consumers didn't bite in as big of droves. The PS2 then launched and though many of the DC games looked better than any of the launch PS2 games the buzz behind the PS2 was almost too big to overcome. Sega didn't think they could compete and pulled support of the system (when at least here in America the DC was holding its own at the time, Japan was a different story). The PS2 also got real lucky with the release of GTA 3 and GT3. If those hadn't launched when they did and Sega actually kept pushing and fighting, it might have had a chance. The lack of EA didn't help things, but their biggest titles at the time (Madden, NBA Live, MLB) all had major competition from the then smoking 2K lines.

I got the impression that while the PS2 took the wind out of Sega's sails, what really killed the Dreamcast off was the Xbox. Sega could have stayed in 3rd place and kept going, but fighting against two behemoths like Sony and Microsoft AND Nintendo who had the handheld market to keep them afloat wasn't going to work. Lack of DVD support didn't help the Dreamcast either. When the PS2 launched people were buying it just because it was a DVD player, and buying a PS3 because it's a BR player. That shouldn't be overlooked.

The 360 failure rate has cost MS money, but how much has the 360 earned the company? If they lose 4 billion on repairs/hardware failure but make 20 billion on sales, that isn't an overall lose. I would like to see how much they have really made and loss....including everything from sales to licensing/etc. NO way I beleive MS is in the RED on the 360, if they are, someone is cookin' the books.

The thing to consider as well is that MS' foray into the console business has brought a lot of games to the PC that weren't there before, strengthening Windows as a gaming platform. There are hardly any Xbox 360 titles that aren't also on Windows, which makes the 360 an undesirable purchase but it's still a win for Microsoft. The unified XNA environment also gives them leverage to go head to head with Apple in the portable market. Windows Phone 7 and Zune HD2 will be getting a good chunk of games from major Xbox 360 developers, meaning stuff like Dead or Alive or Halo on the phone. Overall it's a success, just like how with the PS3 even if it remains in 3rd place for the rest of the generation, since Sony won the format war with BluRay and the PS3 helped Sony win, Sony's going to be making money for ages.

Unless the redesign fixes things. (Crosses fingers)

Don't give too much hope. It's much worse for scratching discs than the original, so if anything they've made it worse.

Good thing about DC was that the gaming library of good titles outweight the not-so-good/bad titles. That's rare with any given console, especially from Japan.

Interesting that its pair in the handheld front, the NGPC is pretty much the same. The DreamCast and the NGPC seem to be viewed positively by everyone, meaning realistically if Sega and SNK wanted to get back into the hardware business they'd receive some strong fan support. Going out with a good system is better than Atari, which wouldn't get any support if they decided to make another home console.

Hep038

06-19-2010, 01:07 AM

physics223

06-19-2010, 02:10 AM

Other than failed consoles the moment they came out, I think the biggest failue of a console is the Jaguar. I mean, it just sucked and as a swansong for Atari played more like a vuvuzela than a classical piano piece. It totally eradicated what the Atari Lynx achieved for handhelds and instead doomed Atari to have a bad name at the end of its console days. It was a far cry from their utter dominance during the 2600 era, and it was pitiable to see the company die like that.

Ed Oscuro

06-19-2010, 03:24 AM

The Jaguar killed Atari's already damaged reputation AND ruined the company once and for all. I would have to say, because of that, the Jaguar is the single biggest company-affecting failure in the industry, ever.
Well, putting aside that it's not exactly what the OP had in mind, I'm not sure I agree. The Jag, taken on its own, is just a reflection of the poor corporate decisions at Atari at those times. They could have made any aspect of the system out differently but gotten the same result. The thing could've been the freakin' PlayStation and they still would have shat away the guts of the company.

I'll put a vote in for this box sitting next to me, missing its remote - the Memorex VIS. I think that nothing screams "FAIL" like having at most two real games (and, god, golf and The Manhole, which barely counts as a game). It's neat for what it's meant to do but if I had the skill I'd seriously consider making some little game for it just out of pity.

migo

06-19-2010, 03:40 AM

migo

06-19-2010, 03:47 AM

N64.
From a company like Nintendo, it just did not work. Every other nintenod system I own gets play once or twice a month, I actually packed up my N64 and forgot about it. The other day I bought some games from goodwill and got it out to play it and decided it is only taking up space.

Yeah I know there were worse systems out there, but I just expected more and feel the N64 was a failure even in Nintendo's eyes. I know the fanboys always come to the rescue any time a Nintendo system is criticized, but it is funny to see only the real zealots defend the N64, the others just keep quite.:rolleyes:

The N64 had some very highly rated titles that have some considerable name power and produced Super Smash Bros. While by itself it wasn't that successful, and in contrst to the PSX it was a total failure, Nintendo's still able to milk those titles with the Wii and 3DS.

It also sells for more than a GameCube second hand, so people obviously think it still has value.

Auto-Fox

06-19-2010, 08:48 AM

Speaking of 32-64 bit consoles, I'd say Sega's biggest failure has to have been the 32X.
Don't get me wrong, this system DID have potential, just not as a peripheral. Originally, it was going to be its own console, and would have been if the Neptune hadn't been canceled.
Still, because they rushed it into production, it had inferior graphics, sound, and architecture to pretty much everything else on the market.
More than that, the 32X solidified Sega's reputation for abandoning consoles. Hence, the failure of the Saturn, and to a more limited extent, the Dreamcast.
Not that I don't have anything GOOD to say about the plastic 'shroom. There are a bunch of really good games for it, if you look hard enough.
Plus, I may be the only one who thinks this, but I think it looks really cool attached to a Genesis model 2 and a model 2 Sega CD.

Aswald

06-19-2010, 09:45 AM

Have upgrades ever really worked?

Aswald

06-19-2010, 09:53 AM

Well, putting aside that it's not exactly what the OP had in mind, I'm not sure I agree. The Jag, taken on its own, is just a reflection of the poor corporate decisions at Atari at those times. They could have made any aspect of the system out differently but gotten the same result. The thing could've been the freakin' PlayStation and they still would have shat away the guts of the company.

Is there anyone else here unfortunate enough to actually remember the "cave" infomercial for the Jaguar?

If not, here it is. Prepare to have a brick thrown through the window of your soul.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qJO1SQ3KsE

Apologies in advance.

Enigmus

06-19-2010, 10:17 AM

Is there anyone else here unfortunate enough to actually remember the "cave" infomercial for the Jaguar?

If not, here it is. Prepare to have a brick thrown through the window of your soul.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qJO1SQ3KsE

Apologies in advance.

Hey look Mortal Kombat 3- oh, wait.

Platinum

06-19-2010, 12:04 PM

There is some good answers in here guys.

I once did consider the original Sega Master System as a failure because it did not do much for Sega like they had hoped, sure it was successful in Europe...

But then I realized, the Master System is still living on in Brazil.

migo

06-19-2010, 12:20 PM

Got any details on the Master System? Is it an actual console with adjustable games or is it one of those 20-in-1 systems?

migo

06-19-2010, 12:22 PM

Have upgrades ever really worked?

Err, the Xbox 360 Arcade hard drive upgrade?

Enigmus

06-19-2010, 12:35 PM

Err, the Xbox 360 Arcade hard drive upgrade?

Two words: red ring.

migo

06-19-2010, 12:47 PM

That's completely unrelated to the hard drive upgrade.

Jorpho

06-19-2010, 11:43 PM

Got any details on the Master System? Is it an actual console with adjustable games or is it one of those 20-in-1 systems?Its Brazilian longevity is quite well-established and widely known; it even got perfectly legitimate ports of games that came out much later. Wikipedia should tell you more.

Gameguy

06-20-2010, 01:14 AM

Have upgrades ever really worked?
Does the Super Game Boy count? Or the N64 expansion pack?

Arkhan

06-20-2010, 03:47 AM

Does the Super Game Boy count? Or the N64 expansion pack?

The PCE CD is an upgrade, right?

that worked pretty good!

Rickstilwell1

06-20-2010, 06:50 AM

ConsoleAddict

06-20-2010, 11:11 AM

The Emerson Arcadia 2001 also crashed pretty hard because the Atari 5200 and Coleco Vision were way better at the time. The Emerson looked totally last-gen when compared to those two systems, like it thought it was Intellivision or something. I'm probably one of the few on this site who actually has an Arcadia 2001. I never see anyone else post about it.

The Emerson Arcadia 2001 also had big plans to have nothing but rip-offs of established games make up the bulk of their library. However, after the K.C. Munchkin lawsuit, Emerson knew that Atari would be gunning for them if they released any of their clones on the market.

Doonzmore

06-21-2010, 12:44 AM

There's something I've never quite understood about the whole virtual boy fiasco. Virtual Boy came out in August of 95 and was discontinued in less than a year. The N64 came out in 96 so both consoles must have at one point been in development simultaneously. Snes was doing fine and all the magazines were touting the N64 as the next big Nintendo console. Where was Virtual Boy supposed to fit in? Was it ever meant to be Nintendo's future?

migo

06-21-2010, 12:58 AM

"According to David Sheff's book Game Over, Yokoi never actually intended for the console to be released in its present form. However, Nintendo pushed the Virtual Boy to market so that it could focus development resources on the Nintendo 64.[2]"

From Wikipedia.

That still seems odd though, as it would make more sense for them to shelve it entirely.

PapaStu

06-21-2010, 10:23 AM

Err, the Xbox 360 Arcade hard drive upgrade?

Console revision /= to add ons like Sega CD/32X

migo

06-21-2010, 10:26 AM

PapaStu

06-21-2010, 10:38 AM

It's not a revision. The hard drive is an add on, even snaps on to the outside of the case and adds additional functionality (such as backwards compatibility) not supported by the base model. Internally the Arcade is identical to the Pro and Elite Models. It's rather like the Sega Base System and Sega Master System.

You do know that ALL 360 systems can have their hard drives removed correct? I'll take it off my Pro and my Pro then is an Arcade. The reason arcades are 'cheaper' is because they come w/ no hard drive. It's not an upgrade, its a big memory card.

Early Arcade units had nothing internally to save anything, requiring a memory card or the Hard drive to be attached to save game progress or DLC. The new Arcades have 512 MB of internal flash space, to support the NXE and allow for some game saves.

migo

06-21-2010, 11:09 AM

Yes, I know all that. It's common knowledge.

Rob2600

06-21-2010, 01:26 PM

Have upgrades ever really worked?

The N64 Expansion Pak. Based on the sales of Donkey Kong 64, Perfect Dark, The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask, Turok 2, and Star Wars: Rogue Squadron, I'd estimate maybe a third of all N64 owners had one.

j_factor

06-21-2010, 03:42 PM

Arkhan

06-21-2010, 07:19 PM

I suppose not only the PC Engine CD itself, but also the "Super System" upgrade would be an example of a success. I would bet that the majority of PCE CD owners got the ability to play Super CD games.

yeah. i think its the most successful addon of all time probably.

that n64 pack was a crock of shit.

they should have just included that from the get-go.

Rob2600

06-21-2010, 07:27 PM

that n64 pack was a crock of shit.

they should have just included that from the get-go.

Regardless of your opinion, the Expansion Pak was a successful add-on.

And according to your philosophy, the Multitap should've been included with - or built into - the PlayStation and PlayStation 2 from the get go, which I agree with.

pepharytheworm

06-21-2010, 07:39 PM

yeah. i think its the most successful addon of all time probably.

that n64 pack was a crock of shit.

they should have just included that from the get-go.

How is it a crock? Because they didn't release it with the system they shouldn't have released it at all? Its just like with the dual shock controller, yeah it would have better to have gotten it when the sytem was released, but its better than not having it at all.

tomaitheous

06-22-2010, 12:52 AM

I'd estimate maybe a third of all N64 owners had one.

You mean what was left of the N64 user base by 2000/1? Nintendo loyalist fans, explains quite a bit. N64, GC (was rooting for the system myself for a while, until I took a hard look at what was going happen.. and it wasn't the GC that was going happen), and Wii. They all have/had their die-hard fans. Not sure if they're enough to qualify the n64 ram addon as 'successful' though.

How many games actually required the ram expansion pak? I remember the second Zelda game did, but that's all I can remember. LoL @ Nintendo for releasing that game super late in the game, let alone forcing whatever user base that was left to have the expansion pak. Way to milk that last bit of money from the n64, Nintendo. I wouldn't doubt the majority of the expansion sales were from that game.

pepharytheworm

06-22-2010, 01:24 AM

Here's a list of all the games that used the expansion pak and only two had to use it.

Aidyn Chronicles: The First Mage
All-Star Baseball 2001
Armorines: Project S.W.A.R.M.
Army Men: Sarge's Heroes
Battlezone: Rise of the Black Dogs
Castlevania: Legacy of Darkness
Command & Conquer
Cruis'n World
Daikatana
Donkey Kong 64 (had to have expansion)
Duke Nukem: Zero Hour
Extreme-G 2
Excitebike 64
F-1 World Grand Prix II
Gauntlet Legends
Hot Wheels
Hybrid Heaven
Hydro Thunder
Indiana Jones and the Infernal Machine
International Track and Field 2000
Jeremy McGrath's Supercross 2000
Ken Griffey Jr.'s Slugfest
The Legend of Zelda: Majora’s Mask (had to have expansion)
Madden NFL '99
Madden NFL 2000
Mario Golf
NBA Courtside 2
NBA Jam 2000
New Tetris, The
NFL Quarterback Club '99
NFL Quarterback Club 2000
Nuclear Strike 64
Perfect Dark (needs expansion for multi-player)
Pok�mon Stadium 2
Quake 2
Rayman 2: The Great Escape
Re-volt
Resident Evil 2
Road Rash 64
Roadsters
San Francisco Rush 2049
Shadow Man
Spider-Man
South Park
South Park Rally
StarCraft 64 (needs expansion for multi-player)
Star Wars: Episode I: Battle for Naboo
Star Wars: Episode 1: Racer
Star Wars: Rogue Squadron
The World Is Not Enough
Tony Hawk's Pro Skater
Tony Hawk's Pro Skater 2
Tony Hawk's Pro Skater 3
Top Gear Hyper-Bike
Top Gear Overdrive
Top Gear Rally 2
Turok 2: Seeds of Evil
Turok 3: Shadow of Oblivion
Turok: Rage Wars
Vigilante 8
Vigilante 8: 2nd Offense
World Driver Championship
Xena: Warrior Princess: The Talisman of Fate

Thats roughly 20% or 1/5 of all US N64 games that used it. I guess you people feel the Ram Cart for the Saturn was stupid too.

buzz_n64

06-22-2010, 02:30 AM

Thats roughly 20% or 1/5 of all US N64 games that used it. I guess you people feel the Ram Cart for the Saturn was stupid too.

You said it dude! The Playstation, and almost every system in the 90's and early 00's had some sort of add-on or extra feature added in their 2nd half or late in their life span.

Genesis - 32x/cd
CD-i - Digital Video adapter
Saturn - 3d pad/ram card
Playstation - Dual Shock/Analog (Featured game- Ape Escape)
N64 - Expansion Pak
and so on...

CRV

06-22-2010, 05:21 AM

Its Brazilian longevity is quite well-established and widely known; it even got perfectly legitimate ports of games that came out much later. Wikipedia should tell you more.

They haven't released a Master System game on cartridge in years.

todesengel

06-22-2010, 05:36 AM

Here's a list of all the games that used the expansion pak and only two had to use it.Actually Perfect Dark required the RAM pak for the single player mode. Other than those 3 games that required it, I prefer not to use the RAM pak for those other titles since the games would run much faster without it.

Rob2600

06-22-2010, 07:39 AM

You mean what was left of the N64 user base by 2000/1?

The Expansion Pak was released in late 1998. Star Wars: Rogue Squadron, Turok 2: Seeds of Evil, Rayman 2: The Great Escape, and Top Gear Overdrive were the first games to use it.

pepharytheworm

06-22-2010, 01:16 PM

Actually Perfect Dark required the RAM pak for the single player mode. Other than those 3 games that required it, I prefer not to use the RAM pak for those other titles since the games would run much faster without it.

I read that on wiki too, but my Perfect Dark works without it on single. I just couldn't get it to work multi. Maybe I am just remembering wrong. I will have to test again.

What games ran slower? I haven't played any that ran slower most either had just a visual upgrade or smoother frame rate. Never heard of it slowing down. Give me some examples so I can test them out.

Rob2600

06-22-2010, 01:35 PM

What games ran slower? I haven't played any that ran slower most either had just a visual upgrade or smoother frame rate. Never heard of it slowing down. Give me some examples so I can test them out.

A few games got choppy at times in high-res mode. Off the top of my head: Turok 2, Hybrid Heaven, Castlevania: Legacy of Darkness, and Perfect Dark.

Rayman 2, Turok 3, Shadow Man, Top Gear Overdrive, Resident Evil 2, and Indiana Jones are some examples of N64 games that ran well in high-res mode.

Arkhan

06-22-2010, 05:51 PM

Regardless of your opinion, the Expansion Pak was a successful add-on.

It was a success in the same regard that the bigger 360 hard drive was a success. It's the only available option. lol.

They had plans for the thing from the get go. It should have just been there from the get go. More games early on wouldn't have sucked so hard probably.

Its not like they put the expansion port on it and were like "JUST IN CASE WE COME UP WITH SOMETHING LATER"

And according to your philosophy, the Multitap should've been included with - or built into - the PlayStation and PlayStation 2 from the get go, which I agree with.

me too. but at least the multi tap wasn't REQUIRED to play games. Just needed it for >2 people.

todesengel

06-22-2010, 07:53 PM

I read that on wiki too, but my Perfect Dark works without it on single. I just couldn't get it to work multi. Maybe I am just remembering wrong. I will have to test again.

What games ran slower? I haven't played any that ran slower most either had just a visual upgrade or smoother frame rate. Never heard of it slowing down. Give me some examples so I can test them out.I could have sworn that Perfect Dark would only let you play the multiplayer if you didn't have the RAM pak, definitely post about it if you have the time cause now I'm curious. As for games that ran slower choppier, out of the 3 games that I own that use the RAM pak Castlevania Legacy of Darkness (Rob2600 mentioned this one) and Duke Nukem Zero Hour both run pretty slow and choppy to the point that I turn off the high-res mode in both of them. The other game RAM pak game I own is Resident Evil 2 but I don't remember if that one ran slower or choppier, it's been a good while since I had the N64 hooked up.

j_factor

06-22-2010, 09:12 PM

Thats roughly 20% or 1/5 of all US N64 games that used it.

If that's what qualifies it as a success, Sega CD was a success. More than 1/5 of all Sega 16-bit console games were either exclusive to Sega CD or had a Sega CD version.

pepharytheworm

06-22-2010, 10:47 PM

If that's what qualifies it as a success, Sega CD was a success. More than 1/5 of all Sega 16-bit console games were either exclusive to Sega CD or had a Sega CD version.

Did I say that said it was a success. My point was it was utilized and not just a gimick or a "crock" as someone put it. I have no idea how many people had one but I am sure quite a lot did. By the way there is a big difference between a performance add-on and a console add-on. I am sure more people would have bought a sega CD if all it did was just make 1/5 of the games look better or run smoother. The Sega CD did sell over 5 million so not bad really could have been better though..

Rob2600

06-22-2010, 11:10 PM

The other game RAM pak game I own is Resident Evil 2 but I don't remember if that one ran slower or choppier

Resident Evil 2 ran perfectly in high-res mode. It featured Dolby Surround Sound, too. And I loved the analog control option...way better than the default "tank" controls. Angel Studios did an amazing job on that port and even outdid the CD-based PlayStation version.

Again, Rayman 2, Turok 3, Shadow Man, Top Gear Overdrive, Indiana Jones, and Star Wars: Battle for Naboo ran well in high-res mode, too.

YoshiM

06-23-2010, 09:00 AM

I could have sworn that Perfect Dark would only let you play the multiplayer if you didn't have the RAM pak, definitely post about it if you have the time cause now I'm curious.

You need the Expansion Pak in order to access most of the contents including the solo missions. Without the Pak you can play the multiplayer challenges, the 1-to-2 player combat simulator with or without Simulants (up to 8).

danny_galaga

06-25-2010, 09:10 AM

360 has it's flaws, but IN NO WAY is a failure, games sell, best online gaming experience, and many other great features. If the system was a true failure, it either would have only lasted a few years, or Microsoft's next system would've been out already. Just because you might not like the system for one reason or another doesn't put it at Nuon or Virtual Boy status.

Try finding a properly functioning Xbox 360 ten years from now.

What does it matter if a console works ten years from now? It won't be making any more money for the manufacturer. Even CAR manufacturers don't count on much from their cars much after ten years- the rate at which people bother to spend money to repair them with genuine parts drops off very rapidly...

Seaquest

06-26-2010, 03:57 PM

Nintendo: Virtual boy
Sega: Saturn
Atari: Jaguar
All were flops that financialy damaged the companys and crushed their reputations!

todesengel

06-26-2010, 09:20 PM

Nintendo: Virtual boy
Sega: Saturn
Atari: Jaguar
All were flops that financialy damaged the companys and crushed their reputations!The Virtual Boy didn't damage Nintendo in anyway and in no way crushed their reputation. I could argue that the Saturn didn't destroy Sega either since it was a hit in Japan but that would just open up whole new argument.

Edward Randy

06-27-2010, 12:35 AM

Actually, Neo Geo also, because the price was so expensive it was a complete joke. My friends and I had yet another chuckle on that one.

I would consider it a resounding success, considering it had a 10+ year run in a niche market.

WelcomeToTheNextLevel

08-12-2016, 02:33 AM

I have the Casio Loopy. I'm wondering which was the bigger failure, that or its PV-1000 predecessor. The Loopy was a system targeted for girls but it didn't really take hold in Japan because most girls just weren't interested, I guess.

I have a Loopy (though I didn't yet in June 2010 when this comment was posted; I got my Loopy December 25, 2012) - 400 bucks! I think it was the only one on eBay at the time so this thing didn't do very well. It's from Japan which will limit its availability in the USA but go on eBay and you'll be up to your eyeballs in successful Japanese consoles like the Famicom. Loopy probably sold a few hundred thousand at most.

As for BIGGEST failure, that would have to be the Memorex VIS. This was the console that tried to compete with the CD-i and failed miserably. Come on... how bad of a failure do you have to be, to "fail miserably" against the CD-i, which in turn failed miserably compared to the 3DO, which in turn saw very limited success compared to the Sega Genesis and Super Nintendo. The VIS sold just 10,000 units, and was on sale for only two months, November 1992 - January 1993 (gasp... I was born during that two month period) and had a game library that made the CD-i's look as rich and diverse as the SNES by comparison.

AdamAnt316

08-12-2016, 12:25 PM

"Wize fwom your gwabe..."

I can't believe that nobody mentioned the Bentley Compu-Vision (http://www.old-computers.com/museum/computer.asp?c=1026&st=3). A simple Pong clone, based around the GI AY-3-8500 Pong chip. Battery operated with fixed controllers, and a decent set of options for the usual 4 games. Pretty good for 1975 or 1976, right? Except... it was released in 1983! :? Not only were Pong systems several years out-of-date by that time, but the video game crash was rearing its ugly head. If Bentley didn't lose money on it, it's likely because the thing probably cost them around $2 to make... :shameful:
-Adam

Gameguy

08-12-2016, 10:34 PM

I can't believe that nobody mentioned the Bentley Compu-Vision (http://www.old-computers.com/museum/computer.asp?c=1026&st=3).
You can't believe nobody mentioned a console that nobody's heard of before?

Interesting to hear about that, seriously though I never heard about that console before.

SparTonberry

08-13-2016, 01:12 AM

Wasn't the 2600 also released in Japan in 1983, right as the Famicom was about to be released (and SG-1000 and MSX1 which were still a generation above)?
I'd imagine it didn't make too much of an impact over there with such a late release?

AdamAnt316

08-13-2016, 02:03 PM

You can't believe nobody mentioned a console that nobody's heard of before?

Interesting to hear about that, seriously though I never heard about that console before.

They're definitely out there. The first one I ever found was at a yard sale in the mid-late '90s. It was still in its original box, which I'm guessing is common for these things. At the time, I was just getting into collecting video game stuff, and had no idea about its odd place in the world of game consoles. I've found at least a couple others since then (my original ended getting turned into a PongMan (http://www.electronixandmore.com/projects/pongman/index.html)), and I doubt that any of them have been priced at more than $10 (the price which the Pong Story rarity guide (http://www.pong-story.com/mypongs.htm) thinks it's worth), in spite of its historical "oddity", so they must have sold a fair amount of them for some reason (my guess is because they probably were cheap). Exactly how many of them were played is another story, methinks...
-Adam