DS VS. PSP - Ownage

[gepeto]

I own both but recently I have been noticing a sad trend in the stores I visit. The psp section is becoming much smaller and insignificant. The used games are sparce and new releases are still slow. I have yet to see guitaroo man used. I don't believe it is selling at all. I know of no friends that own it. Ton of valkrye profile lennent used. Little support from the store in terms of hype.

Even Gamestop's website stop letting people check the availibility of used psp games. (to be fair they even stopped the ds search but the ds has its legion)


The way I figured the psp days are numbered. Anyone know what the next must have psp title is?

[Three-P]

I got the PSP and the following games for it. (I will edit upon getting more.)

Need For Speed-Most Wanted.
Metal Gear Acid 2.
Namco Museum Battle Collection.
Capcom Classics Collection Remix.
Midway Arcade Treasures Extended Play.
Street Fighter Alpha 3 Max.

And now, that I own the DS, as well, I have the following games for that. (This will be bulked up, too.)

Castlevania-Portrait of Ruin.

(I'm waiting for my Federal tax refund, so I will bulk it up a little.)

[Griking]

Here's last week's Japanese sales numbers. Unfortunately I haven't found a source for Weekly US numbers. Supposingly they're released monthly and not made public.

Console YTD Last Week Change
- DS Lite: 201,177 55,104 (37.72%)
- Wii: 78,550 12,810 (19.49%)
- PSP: 32,175 959 (3.07%)
- PS3: 23,431 4,704 (25.12%)
- PS2: 16,033 1,507 (-8.59%)
- Xbox 360: 4,811 1,319 (-21.52%)
- GBA SP: 980 256 (35.36%)
- Game Boy Micro: 884 166 (-15.81%)
- Gamecube: 383 77 (25.16%)
- DS Phat: 121 2 (1.68%)
- GBA: 36 8 (28.57%)

Source (http://www.joystiq.com/2007/02/16/japanese-hardware-sales-feb-5-feb-11-job-interview-edition/)

Joystiq's Source (http://www.m-create.com/jpn/s_ranking.html) (In Japanese)

You were right Petey, those numbers that I provider earlier WERE an anomolity. The DS outsold the PSP about 55 to 1 last week in Japan. :eek 2:

If Sony released the PSP with the idea of making a nice little handheld that we can all enjoy if we like it but it's no big deal if we don't then I agree with your opinion of Sony's success. But I don't buy this theory. Sony is interested in world dominance and in this light I can't see how the PSP can be considered a critical or financial success. Some weeks it may be by more than others but the DS seems to outsell the PSP each and every week. Is Sony pleased?

[Icarus Moonsight]

Anyone know what the next must have psp title is?

As far as I know it's Castlevania Dracula X Chronicles due out this fall. Though it may not be considered "big". MGS Portable Ops was the last big release that I know of (Dec 06 I think).

[petewhitley]

Here's last week's Japanese sales numbers. Unfortunately I haven't found a source for Weekly US numbers. Supposingly they're released monthly and not made public.

I know I said I was leaving, but I can't sit here and read unopposed propaganda ...

Here you go, January '07 U.S. Hardware Sales (NPD data):

Nintendo DS (239,000 units)
Sony PSP (211,000 units)

Yeah, Nintendo is burying Sony. Again, weekly (and anomalous) Japanese hardware charts are incredibly short-sighted when we're talking about two systems that have been available for well over two years, and as has been demostrated, are both long-term valid competitors to each other.

(And to NinjaJoey23: save the forum etiquette advice for when you become a mod, chief. The only thing more annoying than a guy like me handing out asshole insults on the 'net is a guy like you handing out asshole etiquette tips on the 'net.)

[JJNova]

Yeah, Nintendo is burying Sony.

About time you admit what everyone else already knew.

[petewhitley]

About time you admit what everyone else already knew.

Ha ha. Unfortunately, I have a feeling you're not kidding ...

[petewhitley]

Since I'm at it, here's an interesting graph courtesy of VGCharts.com. This is a comparison of North American sales of both the PSP and the DS over the first 22 months of each respective release (the PSP was released 22 months ago in North America). I'd say something smart-ass here, but honestly, do I need to? It speaks for itself.

http://pgrevolution.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/01/pspmorethan.jpg

[Intelstan]

When I consider purchasing a handheld game console, my main goal is to have fun and enjoy all its features. Money is only a small factor to me because my goal is not to save money. If I wanted to buy a cheap handheld, I'd buy a GBC.

In the round between the DS and the PSP, I would say the PSP wins in looks, gameplay controls, and functionality.
Firstly, I believe in quality over quantity. The dual screens on the DS are definitely an improvement from the GBA, but still not a match for the big wide screen of the PSP. Thus, I would say PSP wins in this area.
Secondly, the DS has the touch screen capability for games while the PSP has the analog stick. I personally like the analog stick more since I don't have to worry about damaging the screen with the pen or my fingers. In my perspective, the PSP wins in this area also.
Lastly, the PSP has the bonus of being a music player, movie player, and web browser. People can say they don't need the features or the features are useless to them, but at least the features are there. I can choose not to listen to mp3s and not watch movies and not surf the web on my PSP. But if own a DS, I don't have a choice. I can't watch movies or play music even if I wanted to.

Overall, the PSP is better in my perspective. The target market is a bit different for the 2 handhelds and cannot be compared 100% fairly.

[PapaStu]

@ petewhitley

The only hard sell with the sales numbers is how they are recorded. Sony counts shipped units, not units sold. Nintendo counts units actually sold.

@ Intelstan
Well its nice that your not going to let cost affect your decision on what system to buy, but I'd think that the games themselves would help decide that for you. If not that, the controls and functionality of the system. There truly is little that has come out on the PSP that isn't a very ugly looking and horrible port of a PS2 game, or just an old game slapped quickly onto the PSP because they could. Some of the unique titles really are nice, don't get me wrong I love me my Loco Roco and Me & My Katamari (even though its butchered) but there realy is little other that holds my attention or even gives me a huge desire to bt played.

Have you handled the PSP and used that Analog stick thats on it? It is incredibly hard to use and the games that I have that use it (Dynasty Warriors, Samurai Warriors along with a few others) arn't helped by it one bit. I long to be able to use the D-Pad and even that has issues registering because of how its been placed in the system.

I guess having it be able to play music and movies and surf the web is nice but what exactly is the purpose of buying a handheld gaming system then? To enjoy all its features? The DS plays games, does WiFi chatting and will surf the net here in America when Nintendo finally gets around to releasing the Opera DS browser thats already out in Japan. The PSP plays games, movies on its propietary format (which is no longer being supported by the Movie distributors), does play MP3's (a function that i've never used mine for once) and surfs the web to an ok degree, but its really not worth using if you've got any typing of any kind that you plan on doing due to the 'keyboard' function of it.

Now having babbled all that, I own both a DS and a PSP. I bought my DS at launch, and got a PSP a year after launch. My personal DS collection is almost 7 times my PSP one (96-15) and your biggest DS worries (scratches on screens/fingerprints) have never been a problem to mine (there are no scratches). I'm actually more worried about scratching my PSP screen than my DS one due to its constant exposure.

[NinjaJoey23]

The only thing more annoying than a guy like me handing out asshole insults on the 'net is a guy like you handing out asshole etiquette tips on the 'net.

Well, at least you admitted to the nature of your insults. Good luck fighting the good fight, chief.

[petewhitley]

Oh no, the sky is falling. The top PSP game sold FOURTEEN times more than the nearest DS game ... Here's the Japanese top ten software sellers for last week (only posted to show numerous earlier posters how ridiculous it is to base arguments off of weekly Japanese sales, as obviously this represents a drop-in-the-bucket long term):

1. Monster Hunter Portable 2nd - 705,281 units sold last week (new entry / Capcom, PSP)
2. Higurashi no Naku Koro ni - 80,002 (new entry / Alchemist, PS2)
3. Fire Emblem: Dawn Goddess - 75,359 (new entry / Nintendo, Wii)
4. Sim City DS - 50,826 (new entry / EA, DS)
5. Professor Layton and the Mysterious Town - 49,979 (186,716 sales to date / Level-5, DS)
6. Wii Sports - 47,503 (1,090,736 / Nintendo, Wii)
7. Naruto: Gekitou Ninja Taisen EX - 45,792 (new entry / Tomy, Wii)
8. Dragon Quest Monsters Joker - 40,507 (1,174,576 / SquareEnix, DS)
9. Wii Play - 35,811 (944,586 / Nintendo, Wii)
10. Picross DS - 26,693 (183,357 / Nintendo, DS)

[segagamer4life]

I don't understand people's gripes with the PSP and the controls, I have a PSP and a DS and the controls are fine with both. I keep hearing the same things, about the d-pad and the analog stick, but both systems have their faults and their dead pixels.

now to the graphics, you take any game that came out on the PSP and the DS and put em side by side and the PSP wins hands down. take burnout on the PSP and DS the DS Version looks like crap while the PSP version is a great rendition of the console version. the PSP is getting a bad rap for a simple reason, fanboys. Take a look at the top two selling systems on the market right now, the DS and the Wii, now while I have both and enjoy both, I can see them for what they are, the Wii, although fun, is a glorified Gamecube with some nifty new add-ons... and the DS while likewise fun, it is nothing more than a portable 64 with touch screen capabilities. The PSP while a step up from the psx and a bit behind the PS2, has games out there that are incredible ports, like burnout, need for speed, smackdown vs. raw, twisted metal, syphon filter, Socom, etc. This is a dig at the DS and Wii, basically because they constantly undershoot, they put out a system that is inferior to its competition, yet they rely on the fanboys of the world to help them sell units. The gba, was a glorified snes, the gb, a black and white nes, the pocket a color nes. Nintendo makes good games, but their latest entries in the console war, are behind the times in my book. They are fun for what they are but the real ground breaker is the PSP to me, it takes a console game and brings it damn close to perfection in a handheld. But this is just my opinion.

[Griking]

If the industry is decided by fanboys and supposingly everyone is a Nintendo fanboy then why didn't the N64 win the war over the PSx?

Personally I appreciate Nintendo's current take on gaming. They've said that there really have no interest in fighting an arms race because all it does is give us the same old same old just with prettier graphics and higher prices. Personally I really have no interest in playing the same game over and over again with noting more than a fresh coat of paint. Sure, games on the Wii and DS may not be as pretty as the PS3 and PSP but they also don't cost nearly as much to make so developers are more willing to take chances on new game styles rather than only make sequels or cookie cutter games. Superior technology doesn't necesarily equal fun.

[Bronty-2]

well said, that's how I feel about it also..

[swlovinist]

In short, I like them both. I however think that the PSP like the PS3 has not marketed the system well at all. Also, the types of games the console has been advertised to play is poor. The PSP in short is a portable PS2 that can all sorts of multimedia things. The problem is the two things that have plagued other consoles going up the mighty Nintendo. 1. Price 2. Battery life There is a 70 dollar difference between the two with alot less battery life. These are two problems that Sony needs to address if they want a bigger piece of the pie. I feel the games are there if you look for them, the problem is the damage might already have been done. The Sony of today reminds me of the Nintendo of the 90s....too prideful to admit when the direction of something is going south.

[attilathehun]

Spoken like a true nintendo fanboys. The reason why Sony has sold millions is because they got the money and sure know how to use it well when marketing their product.

Sony's machines has and will compile the largest and diverse libraries known to mankind.

Back in the 90's Nintendo tried to conquer and divide but lost to Sony.

[GillianSeed]

Spoken like a true nintendo fanboys.

It's my experience that people resort to name calling when they have nothing of value to say. It's not "fanboys" that are driving DS sales, it's the casual gamers that have been deserted by Sony and Microsoft.

[segagamer4life]

It's my experience that people resort to name calling when they have nothing of value to say. It's not "fanboys" that are driving DS sales, it's the casual gamers that have been deserted by Sony and Microsoft.

then what is driving the Wii sales? and before you say innovation, the PS3/360 have that, the gimmick of the wii is its controller, I know that, throw that out the window and play the games, the wii is a gamecube with a gimicky controller. The DS is a glorified n64 with a touch screen, the psp, while like I said maybe a ps1-ps2, middle of the road machine, it is hands down a better and superior console. the controls aren't as bad as people make them out to be, I don't get that statement, I have played everything from dynasty warriors to gta, to ghost rider and all in between, and never once has the dpad or analog stick failed me, or caused me angst. I don't see the issue there. Now, before this gets to be a flame war, I want to be clear that my opinion is based on sheer tech specs, and thats it. There is a fun factor and a human factor involved as well, thats where any "fan-boyism" can be seen, but that's not what we're here to discuss. The PSP is a more powerful system, the DS was under achieved by Nintendo in my opinion, same with the Wii, While I enjoy both, I am dismayed at where N, stops as far as pushing the envelope, while the PSP attempts to give you PS2 calibur games, the DS take you back to the 64 with diddy kong. and games that while innovative yes with the touch screen, the DS is a step back, in time, while the PSP is going forward. Anyway, I don't condon calling people "Fanboys", hell we're all fanboys. Anyway I have ranted enough.

[jajaja]

It's not "fanboys" that are driving DS sales, it's the casual gamers that have been deserted by Sony and Microsoft.

How can a company desert the consumers? Its the other way around, its the consumers that desert the companies.



then what is driving the Wii sales?

The new way of playing and Zelda:TP.

[segagamer4life]

How can a company desert the consumers? Its the other way around, its the consumers that desert the companies.




The new way of playing and Zelda:TP.

true... but take the controller away and the Wii, is a gamecube....

[jajaja]

true... but take the controller away and the Wii, is a gamecube....

Well.. Wii is build on GC, thats why they can obtain 100% backward compability. Just disable some hardware at its 100% like a GC :) But its more powerful, got more features etc.

[segagamer4life]

Well.. Wii is build on GC, thats why they can obtain 100% backward compability. Just disable some hardware at its 100% like a GC :) But its more powerful, got more features etc.



you're right, I forget the wii "abilities", my bad... good point :-)

[GillianSeed]

How can a company desert the consumers?

By targeting a very narrow audience, the Gears of War/GTA crowd. The average Joe who doesn't play games 5 hours each night, who isn't interested in FPS games, has been left out in the cold for some time now.

My dad has been wanting to buy a console for a long time, I even let him borrow my Xbox, but it was just too complicated for him. Most folks don't have the time or inclination to memorize complex control schemes -- progress has been measured by the amount of buttons and sticks you can cram onto a controller.

DS and Wii controls, on the other hand, are very intuitive and easy to pick up and play. And there are games that target a broader audience: Clubhouse Games, Wii Sports, etc.

[GillianSeed]

The DS is a glorified n64 with a touch screen, the psp, while like I said maybe a ps1-ps2, middle of the road machine, it is hands down a better and superior console.

By that logic, the Jaguar was superior to the Genesis -- it was more powerful, and that's all the counts right?



I have played everything from dynasty warriors to gta, to ghost rider and all in between

If playing a bunch of PS2 ports is what floats your boat, then that's great. But judging by the sales figures, it would appear that the public at large finds the DS to have the more compelling software library.

[segagamer4life]

By that logic, the Jaguar was superior to the Genesis -- it was more powerful, and that's all the counts right?




If playing a bunch of PS2 ports is what floats your boat, then that's great. But judging by the sales figures, it would appear that the public at large finds the DS to have the more compelling software library.



1. Yes, by the same logic the gamegear was superior to the GB.. as was the Lynx. Those systems failed due to pricing issues, such as the Jaguar and the Jaguar was helped along by the megar games that were released for it.


2. Ports are fine, and both systems have them, "compelling software" isn't exclusive to the DS. The DS has the potential to be a great machine, that plays dual screened GBA (looking) games or n64 left overs. The fanboys have spoken both with the DS and the Wii, they were dormant, while the n64 died and some even jumped ship to the Sony raft, but they are back, and they are letting their "dollars" be heard.

[jajaja]

By targeting a very narrow audience, the Gears of War/GTA crowd. The average Joe who doesn't play games 5 hours each night, who isn't interested in FPS games, has been left out in the cold for some time now.

My dad has been wanting to buy a console for a long time, I even let him borrow my Xbox, but it was just too complicated for him. Most folks don't have the time or inclination to memorize complex control schemes -- progress has been measured by the amount of buttons and sticks you can cram onto a controller.

DS and Wii controls, on the other hand, are very intuitive and easy to pick up and play.

With the 8000 PS2 games, im sure there are something for everyone ;) There are so many "unknown" games out there so many think that i.e Xbox is for hardcore gamers only. PS2 is also a very family-based console.

I know many say that the new consoles are too complicated for "old" people. Sure, the controllers have gotten more buttons, but saying that a 50 year old person arent able to play new consoles isnt right. They get scared, pick the controller up for 2 minutes and say "hey, too many buttons, im confused" then never touch it again. A person with 50 years of life experience should be able to control more than 3-4 buttons hehe.

I know the DS and Wii is easier to play with, but with some practice im sure a 80 year old guy can use a PS2/Xbox/GC controller. It also depends alot on how interested the person is willing to learn/want to play of course.

[Griking]

then what is driving the Wii sales? and before you say innovation, the PS3/360 have that, the gimmick of the wii is its controller, I know that, throw that out the window and play the games, the wii is a gamecube with a gimicky controller.

Personally I look at a console that has nothing new to offer other than prettier graphics as being a gimmick as well. I can't tell you if the Wii and it's controller will be a success or not but I give Nintendo credit for having the balls to try something different.

[Griking]

1. Yes, by the same logic the gamegear was superior to the GB.. as was the Lynx. Those systems failed due to pricing issues

Would those be the same pricing issues that the PSP and PS3 currently have now?




The fanboys have spoken both with the DS and the Wii, they were dormant, while the n64 died and some even jumped ship to the Sony raft, but they are back, and they are letting their "dollars" be heard.

If they were true fanbous as you claim they wouldn't have abandoned the N64 for the Playstation. Perhaps it wasn't just a fanbot issue, perhaps they were just gamer who went with what they felt was the better system at the time. And perhaps they've done the same thing this generation as well

[attilathehun]

It's my experience that people resort to name calling when they have nothing of value to say. It's not "fanboys" that are driving DS sales, it's the casual gamers that have been deserted by Sony and Microsoft.Look it's not some personal attack. There's no crime in being a fanboy. I call it the way I see it. I used to be a very bad fanboy from 95-97.

The psp was launched like 2 years ago and they have sold at least 20 million units and it's in disc format. It isn't like buying the sega saturn in 1995 with 2 games and controllers for $400 just see the shelf life dry up in a couple of years. The psp is staying.

The reality of the situation is if it is wasn't for the big $ that Sony has to throw around you would all be still playing hand held nintendos that you can't even see the games you're playing. Oh that's just awsome because the battery life lasts longer.

I've played gb, gbc, gba, gba sp, ds, gg, nomad and psp.

I have ds but it's properly lit or I wouldn't of got one. The only advantage of the ds is that like the gba sp it's clam shell design make's the most conveniant to carry around. That's the only positive innovation that nintendo ever brought to the table in the hand held market.

[segagamer4life]

Would those be the same pricing issues that the PSP and PS3 currently have now?


So, 129, for a DS and 199 for the PSP... the ps3 is 500 or 600 bucks compared to the 400 Bucks for the 360...

look at the games, compare the prices of games, there are a handful of "innexpensive" titles on the DS and PSP, now, most first party homegrown DS and PSP games are 34.99 and 39.99 respectively. Now is the pricing right by Nintendo? no, when you consider what you're paying for. You pay 34.99 for a "innovative" n64 or worse, dual screened GBA game, whereas, for 5 bucks more, you can get a PS2 calibur game on a handheld. To me the DS is over rated and over priced and under delivered. PSP delivers a "last gen" caliber gameplay, while the DS is "innovating" us with N64 and GBA stuff. (Don't get it wrong, there are a HANDFUL, of games that are nice and new on the DS, but those games are few and far between).

[jcalder8]

After owning a DS lite from the day it came on the market I just bought a PSP last weekend. I bought it because of a lack of games that I wanted to play on the DS and for emulation. I love the thought of taking old school games on the road. Now that I have been using the PSP for a week I find that I like how it feels in my hands more than the ds and I'm starting to look into getting more games for it. I'll admit to having big hands which have often caused my hands to cramp while using controllers so this happening while using the DSL was not a foreign thought, I am one of the weird people who like the original Xbox controllers best for this reason, but the extra size of the PSP feels good in my hands.

I'm no graphics whore but damn some of these games look sweet on the PSP but at the same time the first time I saw a bicycle kick in Fifa 06 on the DS my jaw drop that this could happen on a hand held.

I have yet to have a problem with the battery life on the PSP but I've also only had it for a week and the test will be coming tomorrow when I have an 8 hour plane ride. I already know that its good on the DS but I don't have much to compare it too.

I think that the DS has some amazingly innovative games but they have a limited shelve life. I really enjoyed Nintendogs for the first week but then it became having to look after the dog whenever I was going into work and I didn't feel like doing that much. The same thing happened with Animal Crossing, I mean I don't like pulling weeds at my own house why do I want to do it in a game.

The PSP on the other hand doesn't have the same kind of ground breaking games but it has ones where I can see myself coming back to over and over such as Wipeout, Twisted Metal, Metal Gear Solid and Ratchet & Clank: SM.

Really it all comes down to personal choice about which one is better. At least thats the way I see it I could be wrong.

[jajaja]

Personally I look at a console that has nothing new to offer other than prettier graphics as being a gimmick as well. I can't tell you if the Wii and it's controller will be a success or not but I give Nintendo credit for having the balls to try something different.

Which console(s) only offer more gfx as something new?

[GillianSeed]

To me the DS is over rated and over priced and under delivered.

Well apparently you're in the minority, the DS is still going strong. In February, according to NPD, the DS sold 485k units while the PSP sold 176k units. And they could have sold more if they'd been able to get more on the shelves. So strong in fact that, according to 1up.com, retailers are threatening to dump the PSP if Sony doesn't do something about the high price.

I may eventually buy one for Dracula X Chronicles, but as a handheld system overall it's a bust. The market has clearly rejected the expensive, multimedia iPod "killer" approach to handhelds. And simple ports of PS2 titles don't really address the fact that people play their handhelds differently than they play on their consoles. (five minutes here, 15 minutes there)

[segagamer4life]

Well apparently you're in the minority, the DS is still going strong. In February, according to NPD, the DS sold 485k units while the PSP sold 176k units. And they could have sold more if they'd been able to get more on the shelves. So strong in fact that, according to 1up.com, retailers are threatening to dump the PSP if Sony doesn't do something about the high price.

I may eventually buy one for Dracula X Chronicles, but as a handheld system overall it's a bust. The market has clearly rejected the expensive, multimedia iPod "killer" approach to handhelds. And simple ports of PS2 titles don't really address the fact that people play their handhelds differently than they play on their consoles. (five minutes here, 15 minutes there)

You have to get Dracula X Chronicles.. .man does that look fruckin sweet.

I know my opinion is the minority, and I don't look to sales figures, like I have said I own both systems and appreciate both, my initial point of getting involved with this thread was to discuss or get the point accross of the PSP
superiority, on a hardware and software level, that's all, I know the DS is selling circles around it, I begrudgingly attribute that to the Fanboys... but obviously I have no fact to base that on, anyway. I like both systems but the PSP to me is even sweeter.

[GillianSeed]

I know my opinion is the minority, and I don't look to sales figures, like I have said I own both systems and appreciate bothThe PSP was an interesting idea, but the high price just killed it -- especially when combined with an early focus on ports. Handhelds are even more of a luxury item than consoles, and I think people figured why spend that much to replay games they've already beaten on the PS2. Whereas you needed to buy a DS if you wanted to play Brain Age, Nintendogs, Phoenix Wright, Clubhouse Games, New Super Mario Brothers, etc. That's what makes the DS library stronger IMO. I think Sony is finally starting to get the idea, but it's probably too late.

[GillianSeed]

Which console(s) only offer more gfx as something new?The 360 and PS3, obviously -- it's just more FPS, sports titles and GTA clones with prettier graphics.

[jajaja]

The 360 and PS3, obviously -- it's just more FPS, sports titles and GTA clones with prettier graphics.

Was it possible to download games, old arcade games, use PS Home, tilt sensor (official release), watch HD movies etc etc. on PS2 and Xbox? If so, how?

[GillianSeed]

Was it possible to download games, old arcade games

Yeah, Xbox Live was launched in 2004.



use PS Home


I guess this could be considered "new" for consoles -- but it's basically Sony's answer to Second Life. (which has been around since 2003 in one form or another) It's not really going to change the way the games themselves are played, it's more of a social networking tool. It's basically a 3D version of Xbox Live.



tilt sensor (official release)


Pretty clearly inspired by the postive reaction to the Wii.


watch HD movies

This isn't really innovation. The PS2 and Xbox let you play DVDs, the PS3 and 360 let you play HD DVDs. It's more of the same, and again has little if anything to do with gaming.

[jajaja]

Yeah, Xbox Live was launched in 2004.

Xbox Live on 360 is different from the Xbox version, got more and new features.


I guess this could be considered "new" for consoles -- but it's basically Sony's answer to Second Life. (which has been around since 2003 in one form or another) It's not really going to change the way the games themselves are played, it's more of a social networking tool. It's basically a 3D version of Xbox Live.

If you want to say it like that, the Wii controller is nothing new either. Motion sensing have excisted for ages. Todays consoles are much more than just games you buy in the stores. Here we are talking about new stuff to the consoles, not about gaming evolving.



Pretty clearly inspired by the postive reaction to the Wii.

Nintendo was not the first to invent motion sensing in games. But what different does it make if it was inspired by Nintendo, Buddah, KFC general, John Paul II or Hitler himself? Its still a new feature, doesnt matter who came up with it first. Again, we are talking about what features the consoles brings.


This isn't really innovation. The PS2 and Xbox let you play DVDs, the PS3 and 360 let you play HD DVDs. It's more of the same, and again has little if anything to do with gaming.

Yet again, we are talking about what features the consoles brings, not about gaming evolving or whats inovating. The previous consoles were not able to play HD-DVD og BR movies, ergo, a new feature.

[esquire]

By targeting a very narrow audience, the Gears of War/GTA crowd. The average Joe who doesn't play games 5 hours each night, who isn't interested in FPS games, has been left out in the cold for some time now.

Yeah, you're right. Games like Amplitude, Frequency, ICO, Shadow of the Colossus, Okami, Katamari Damacy, Gitaroo Man, Rez, Guitar Hero I & II, the DDR series, Beatmania, God of War, Lumines, Disgaea, Final Fantasy X, X-2, XI and XII, Rogue Galaxy, the Karaoke Revolution series, Shadow Hearts, Kingdom Hearts, Jak 3, Sly 2: Band of Thieves, Ratchet & Clank: up Your Arsenal, Tony Hawk's Underground, Tekken 5, Virtua Fighter 4: Evolution, Klonoa 2, Maximo and the Eye Toy games are all targeted towards the Gears of War/GTA crowd, and either stink or offer nothing new, especially to the casual gamer.

If you can't find something to play in that list alone, I don't what to tell you as that is a very broad spectrum of games, many of which are A-List titles.


The 360 and PS3, obviously -- it's just more FPS, sports titles and GTA clones with prettier graphics.

Yeah, XBOX Live doesn't offer anything new over the Gamecube or Wii's online gaming service, oh wait...

Also, if the Wii is such an "enlightened" console, why are there ports of Call of Duty 3, Far Cry, Splinter Cell Double Agent, Marvel Ultimate Alliance, Madden, Tiger Woods, and a host of kiddie game franchises and Gamecube rehashes (GT Pro Series, Monster 4x4 World Circuit and Rampage)? Add in another FPS, Red Steel, and it seems to me there's not much there in that list other than the added gimmick of the Wiimote.

Statements like yours clearly show your ignorance and lend people to make accusations of fanboyism, because you can't even back up your own accusations, but rather make overall, generalizing, bald faced statements.

[attilathehun]

Well apparently you're in the minority, the DS is still going strong. In February, according to NPD, the DS sold 485k units while the PSP sold 176k units. And they could have sold more if they'd been able to get more on the shelves. So strong in fact that, according to 1up.com, retailers are threatening to dump the PSP if Sony doesn't do something about the high price.

I may eventually buy one for Dracula X Chronicles, but as a handheld system overall it's a bust. The market has clearly rejected the expensive, multimedia iPod "killer" approach to handhelds. And simple ports of PS2 titles don't really address the fact that people play their handhelds differently than they play on their consoles. (five minutes here, 15 minutes there)Sony is notorious for price dumping. The psp has and will continue to drop. Just the psx and ps2.

So simple n64 ports are kool on the ds, but ps2 ports really suck?

Metriod Prime Hunters or what ever it's called looks and sounds very similiar to gc but it's a pain to play from a controller stand point. Goldeneye also a pain the butt. Mario Kart DS is one of the better N64 ports out there.

Unless you have hdtv the graphics of the psp is way better than the ps2.

[Griking]

Was it possible to download games, old arcade games, use PS Home, tilt sensor (official release), watch HD movies etc etc. on PS2 and Xbox? If so, how?

I don't subscribe to Live but didn't the original Xbox allow you to download older games? Old arcade games? Aren't there enough greatest hits collections out for you already? PS3 home? Meh! I don't need a virtual home to walk around in and show me reminders of what I've done. Tilt sensor? There was a controller for the original Playstation that offered that. HD movies? I have no interest in watching movies on my game console. What's next, bundling a converter box and a TiVo into my game console for only $300 more in the name of convenience?

It really sounds to me that all the current gen marketing has gotten to many here. I hate to say it but I think a lot of people here have drunken the Kool Aid.

[esquire]

HD movies? I have no interest in watching movies on my game console. What's next, bundling a converter box and a TiVo into my game console for only $300 more in the name of convenience?

It really sounds to me that all the current gen marketing has gotten to many here. I hate to say it but I think a lot of people here have drunken the Kool Aid.

While I would agree with you as far as the 360 is concerned (the HD-DVD add-on is purely a gimmick since you can't play games on it), the PS3 is different in that it incorporates the high definition and storage capability of the bu-ray media into its games. Therefore, I don't believe the blu-ray technology is some type of extra thrown in there as its necessary to the technology and the gameplay that Sony has incorporated into their console. The ability to watch blu-ray movies is simply an added bonus.

The same argument may have been made when the PS2 switched from CD-ROM to DVD. Sure I didn't need to watch movies on my PS2, but it was there and the system incorporated the technology into gameplay and was used in development (no more 4 disc games), as opposed to the 360 which didn't use the added technology at all.

[jajaja]

I don't subscribe to Live but didn't the original Xbox allow you to download older games? Old arcade games? Aren't there enough greatest hits collections out for you already? PS3 home? Meh! I don't need a virtual home to walk around in and show me reminders of what I've done. Tilt sensor? There was a controller for the original Playstation that offered that. HD movies? I have no interest in watching movies on my game console. What's next, bundling a converter box and a TiVo into my game console for only $300 more in the name of convenience?

It really sounds to me that all the current gen marketing has gotten to many here. I hate to say it but I think a lot of people here have drunken the Kool Aid.

Its possible (or atleast was) to download some arcade style games for Xbox too, i found out after i asked, but Xbox Live for 360 is better with more and new features. What greatest hits collections allows online play? I would like to know that.

Its ok that you dont like or find the new features useful, but what does that have to do with my question? I asked about what consoles that only brought better gfx as a new feature. I.e tilt sensoring is a new feature even if you like it or not. So now that 360 and PS3 are out of the picture i ask again; what console(s) only offers better gfx?

[Griking]

While I would agree with you as far as the 360 is concerned (the HD-DVD add-on is purely a gimmick since you can't play games on it), the PS3 is different in that it incorporates the high definition and storage capability of the bu-ray media into its games.

There's a big difference here. The 360 HD-DVD is OPTIONAL.


Its ok that you dont like or find the new features useful, but what does that have to do with my question? I asked about what consoles that only brought better gfx as a new feature. I.e tilt sensoring is a new feature even if you like it or not. So now that 360 and PS3 are out of the picture i ask again; what console(s) only offers better gfx?

Again, tilt sensor controllers were available for the PSX. It's not new to gaming. It may be the newest "fad" to gaming but it's certainly not new.

Ok, fine. So the PS3 offers more than a new coat of paint. I guess I should have said that it really offers nothing more than a new coat of paint that I really care about.

[jajaja]

Again, tilt sensor controllers were available for the PSX. It's not new to gaming. It may be the newest "fad" to gaming but it's certainly not new.

You're thinking of the 3rd party controller that uses gyros to notice tilting? Same concept, but not the same thing. Both the PS3 and Wii controller can detect 6 axis of motion, the 3rd party thingie for PSX can only detect if the controller is moved to the right or left. MS Sidewinder controller from 2000 or so had the same feature. I even think this had motion if you moved it forward (stalling) and backwards. So the motion sensing is nothing new that Nintendo have came up with. Whats new with Wii is that its a standard controller, not just an accessory. Afaik it can aslo detect angle and where it is in the room, but motion sensing in general, thats not new.


Ok, fine. So the PS3 offers more than a new coat of paint. I guess I should have said that it really offers nothing more than a new coat of paint that I really care about.

There is a difference hehe ;)

[cyberfluxor]

Isn't Sony rolling something out this year to have the PSP interact with the PS3?

[ozyr]

The reality of the situation is if it is wasn't for the big $ that Sony has to throw around you would all be still playing hand held nintendos that you can't even see the games you're playing. Oh that's just awsome because the battery life lasts longer.

:? What the heck is wrong with the GBA SP or DS screen? I see no issue with screen size at all. Yeah, the PSP has a bigger screen and such. So what. It all comes down to what people like. God, I'm so tired of the PSP vs DS debate. I like the DS and GBA myself, but that doesn't mean I hate the PSP. Each to there own.

Also, you state that Nintendo has Sony to thank for their sales of the DS - according to your quote. :hmm: Sounds rather odd to me!?

[esquire]

There's a big difference here. The 360 HD-DVD is OPTIONAL.

Well obviously, and IT DOESN'T ADD ANYTHING TO THE CONSOLE. The whole point of my post is that PS3 Blu-ray drive/player does add to the console, and the ability to watch HD movies is simply an added bonus beyond that.

I find it amusing that people complain that they are being forced to pay for the Blu-ray player, but many of these people have no problem shelling out the money for a Wii, whose games all could have developed on the Gamecube (Zelda). So essentially they're paying $250-$300 to play Gamecube games with the Wiimote.

[jajaja]

I find it amusing that people complain that they are being forced to pay for the Blu-ray player, but many of these people have no problem shelling out the money for a Wii, whose games all could have developed on the Gamecube (Zelda). So essentially they're paying $250-$300 to play Gamecube games with the Wiimote.

I think the reason why people using the word "forced" when it comes to the BR player in the PS3 is that they think its for HD movies only. If this was the case i would agree upto a certaint point since it wouldnt do anything to the games, but thats not how it is.

I would like to know which console(s) that allows you to choose the media to use :)

[Crescent]

I have both consoles and I like both of them, but I usually play PSP more because of the PS1 emu. I have 10 PSP games and 7 NDS games (now playing Castlevania PoR).

[Griking]

Well obviously, and IT DOESN'T ADD ANYTHING TO THE CONSOLE. The whole point of my post is that PS3 Blu-ray drive/player does add to the console, and the ability to watch HD movies is simply an added bonus beyond that.

Yeah, I know that the Blu Ray player is used for games as well. But if Sony were interested in making a game player more than they were in winning the DVD format war they wouldn't have forced their users into investing in something as expensive as a Blue Ray player. There were other options that they could have used. A simple non proprietary double layered DVD player would have been more than sufficient. But no, Sony insisted on using the PS3 as a tool to help cover their costly media war.

[jajaja]

A simple non proprietary double layered DVD player would have been more than sufficient.

A dual layer DVD only fits 8.4GB, thats what PS2, Xbox, 360 and Wii uses. A pretty old technoligy, certainly not next-gen stuff. 8.4GB might be enough for todays games, but they are reaching the 8.4GB limit fast. Less space means that the developers must sacrifice stuff.

There were plans to release 2 PS2 versions, one with CD-ROM and one with DVD-ROM. Some ment that CD was enough. In the begining there were many small PS2 games, some were even CD based so it was enough space then, but look at God of War 2, its like 8.1GB large and this is a PS2 game.

[attilathehun]

:? What the heck is wrong with the GBA SP or DS screen? I see no issue with screen size at all. Yeah, the PSP has a bigger screen and such. So what. It all comes down to what people like. God, I'm so tired of the PSP vs DS debate. I like the DS and GBA myself, but that doesn't mean I hate the PSP. Each to there own.

Also, you state that Nintendo has Sony to thank for their sales of the DS - according to your quote. :hmm: Sounds rather odd to me!?My point mr. frankentstein head is was without the looming psp in the market nintendo hand helds would still be in the dark.

[Ran]

Trust me, but the size IS needed. Textures can be made much better, and we can have more videos (making of and so on without having to swap discs).
DVD9 is way to old, especially in 2-3 years.

[cyberfluxor]

This topic is still being posted to as a Company vs. Company war. Why can't everyone go back to being gamers and requesting the good games. :)

[Griking]

"During it's third quarter fiscal report, Sony admitted that worldwide shipping numbers for the PSP handheld were down by 72% from last year. Only 1.76 million were sent out to stores."

Ouch!

Under "The Good, The Bad and The Ugly".

[ozyr]

My point mr. frankentstein head is was without the looming psp in the market nintendo hand helds would still be in the dark.

You are so full of it...... GET BENT!

[chrisbid]

not having to use multiple disks in a game is a nice feature... so long as it doesnt cost anything extra. its not something worth spending 200 dollars for.

[ShenmueFan]

I don't have a PSP but think it would be a good investment when they redesign the sucker later this year and *hopefully* drop the price.

The DS graphics are lacking, sure...but it's small, has great battery life and has the best overall library for portable gaming right now (for a system still being supported, that is)