PETA versus Tanooki wearing Mario

[Amon_Re]

What if you didn't consider an animal so much as a pet but more of an equal? Like with marriage? Would they have a problem with someone marrying an animal to be treated as an equal?

Southpark did it.

[treismac]

The only reason why there are still starving countries is because we let them starve.

Proof.
*

Even though this video is long, I set it to the part that deals with how the British under Lord Lytton let eight millions of Indians starve of death while they literally had the biggest banquet in recorded history for the coronation of Queen Vicotria.

* Actually, in this case, British policy caused the famine to be as horrific as it was.

[Buyatari]

Now if PETA was smart they would breed a chicken that tastes like shit and leak them out into the population.

[Sunnyvale]

You'd be surprised, a lot of more 'primitive' cultures treat their life stock better then us.

Up until the day they die. Then it's slow, gruesome, get adrenaline in the meat methods...

[The only reason why there are still starving countries is because we let them starve.

Of course, it has nothing to do with the governments of those countries.
http://www.christianaction.org.za/ne...ic_poverty.htm

It's a lot simpler then that really. Treating your life stock decently prevents the outbreaks of massive epidemics (bird flu anyone?) and removes the need to feed animals massive quantities of antibiotics which improves the usability of antibiotics (you slow down the rise of resistant germs).

So even if you care little about the animal's well being (it's going to be killed anyway) you still have a lot of things to gain by improving the quality of life these animals have.

Bird flu has been around a little while longer than beak-searing.
http://www.avianinfluenza.org/bird-flu-origins.php

Improving their quality of life wouldn't help us a bit. Keeping them from being fed bone meal might.

1) Comparing the will to reduce unneeded suffering in life stock to starving kids in Africa is nothing more then lazy ass deflecting
2) Humans are the most cruel species in this world, we seem to enjoy the suffering of others. Want proof? Click this link to an image (not going to embed it into this post for the more easily offended people):
http://lh5.ggpht.com/-uzhNFXP4CW8/Rd...8/patience.jpg
3) Proper treatment of life stock improves the quality of the meat and reduces illnesses in the life stock

1)The two are intertwined. I've already pointed this out earlier.
2)Bot flies. Wasps that lay eggs inside of living spiders for the young to eat their way through their brains slowly. Equating the perversion of some humans to the entire species is no better than saying all Pit Bulls are bad dogs.
3)Ever eat wild game before? Quality is crap, and the potential for human illness is higher.

It's NEVER ok to declaw a cat.

Own an aggressive cat and a small child at the same time. Bye-bye claws.

If you want to save as much of a resource as possible you wouldn"t need to sear off their beaks. It's more efficient/healthy to actually grow less animals in the same space as you reduce the need for antibiotics and the risks of sicknesses wiping out the whole stock.

Not more effecient. That's why free-range chicken costs a ton more. Again, when one says 'starving kids', it's part and parcel to this discussion.

[Collector_Gaming]

Now if PETA was smart they would breed a chicken that tastes like shit and leak them out into the population.

but having a hand in breeding which in turns kinda makes it domestication of some degree is something they would be completely against

Therefore it would never happen.

Which is why this group is so stupid they can't even organize in way that would effect the masses in such a way where we couldn't do anything about it. because everything outside of rioting is basically against their rules and regulations and beliefs.

Imagine if they did do such. and the chickens spread from farm to farm. what chaos that would ensue.

and all they would have to do is convince a few of their more hardcore members to take the hit. believing they were doing good in their life. when the feds coming knocking on doors looking for whos to blame.

Works on the same idea as your large gangs like MS13

[Amon_Re]

Up until the day they die. Then it's slow, gruesome, get adrenaline in the meat methods...

And that invalidates my point.... how? Because we're going to kill them slowly we shouldn't respect them while they are still alive?

Of course, it has nothing to do with the governments of those countries.
http://www.christianaction.org.za/ne...ic_poverty.htm

Oh please, spare me the propaganda. We've gone to war for just about anything except to thrown down a government that's leeching out it's own people.

If we truly wanted to end world hunger we could. We have the means we just lack the will (and there's no $'s to gain).

Bird flu has been around a little while longer than beak-searing.
http://www.avianinfluenza.org/bird-flu-origins.php

I never said that was causing bird flu. This is a fallacy. What I did say is that stuffing lots of birds in small cages stacked next to each other facilitates contamination.

Improving their quality of life wouldn't help us a bit. Keeping them from being fed bone meal might.

Ever wondered why for instance a flock of birds doesn't drop dead due to bird flu?

1)The two are intertwined. I've already pointed this out earlier.

And it's already shown why that argument is bs

2)Bot flies. Wasps that lay eggs inside of living spiders for the young to eat their way through their brains slowly. Equating the perversion of some humans to the entire species is no better than saying all Pit Bulls are bad dogs.

Hunting for 'sport', bull fighting, general animal cruelty and cruelty towards other members of our own species, wars, genocide,... I'd say we humans have a pretty bad track record. And that's all besides the point. We have the choice to treat life stock better but we don't because we don't care and we worship the $.

3)Ever eat wild game before? Quality is crap, and the potential for human illness is higher.

As a matter of fact, yes I've eaten wild game before as well as local cattle. Quality surpasses that what you'll find in a supermarket any day, not to mention the lack of steroids & antibiotics.

Own an aggressive cat and a small child at the same time. Bye-bye claws.

This is the most cruel thing you can do to a cat. Either you get rid of the cat or you make damned sure your kid isn't left alone with your cat. Take some damned responsibility for once in your damned life.

Not more effecient. That's why free-range chicken costs a ton more. Again, when one says 'starving kids', it's part and parcel to this discussion.

Mentioning starving kids is a fallacy. no matter we have free range chicken or not they'll still be starving. Lack of food isn't the reason why they're starving.

[Guru of Time and Space]

Soooo many fallacies in this thread.
Oof.

-GoTaS

[Sunnyvale]

And that invalidates my point.... how? Because we're going to kill them slowly we shouldn't respect them while they are still alive?

You said primitive cultures treat their livestock better than us. I was simply showing that is not the case.

Oh please, spare me the propaganda. We've gone to war for just about anything except to thrown down a government that's leeching out it's own people.

Ahem, please open a history book. And ask the Kurds how things were going before we showed up. Are those AJ's words I'm hearing?

If we truly wanted to end world hunger we could. We have the means we just lack the will (and there's no $'s to gain).

Yup! And after world hunger is ironed out by a bunch of tree-huggers on PC's, they can finally finish that perpetual motion machine they've been telling me about.

Reality check.

I never said that was causing bird flu. This is a fallacy. What I did say is that stuffing lots of birds in small cages stacked next to each other facilitates contamination.

Yes it does. Which is why we use antibiotics. Yes, the bugs get stronger as our medicine advances, It's an arms race. One we're winning.

I never said that was causing bird flu. This is a fallacy. What I did say is that stuffing lots of birds in small cages stacked next to each other facilitates contamination.
Ever wondered why for instance a flock of birds doesn't drop dead due to bird flu?

Um... They are the carriers. Typhoid Mary's of the animal kingdom. They don't get sick as often, but when the local farmer's chickens get sick, they probably got it from wild birds.

And it's already shown why that argument is bs

Saying something vehemently don't prove shit. Money is and has been the issue for centuries. You donate lots of meat to charities? Why not? Cause of money?

Hunting for 'sport', bull fighting, general animal cruelty and cruelty towards other members of our own species, wars, genocide,... I'd say we humans have a pretty bad track record. And that's all besides the point. We have the choice to treat life stock better but we don't because we don't care and we worship the $.

Wolverines, cats, even certain species of insect hunt for sport. Bull fighting... a cat toying with a mouse for a few hours... Chimps do the genocide thing on other chimps as well. Nature isn't all Kumbaya.

As a matter of fact, yes I've eaten wild game before as well as local cattle. Quality surpasses that what you'll find in a supermarket any day, not to mention the lack of steroids & antibiotics.

Gamey meat is better tasting than farm-raised? Yeah, and naturally occurring rocks are a better source of gold than a coin. All those eons of farming haven't taught us anything

This is the most cruel thing you can do to a cat. Either you get rid of the cat or you make damned sure your kid isn't left alone with your cat. Take some damned responsibility for once in your damned life.

I can think of a number of crueler things I could do to a cat. Have any kids? Hover over them 24/7? Oh, so if I get a gal pregnant, we should give the cat to a 'shelter' (concentration camp)? Take responsibility? I am! For my species and my children. Fuck the other guy's till mine are squared away!

Mentioning starving kids is a fallacy. no matter we have free range chicken or not they'll still be starving. Lack of food isn't the reason why they're starving.

Man, I don't even know how to respond to that. 'Timmy, you're not starving because of lack of food."
If food was so cheap and plentiful it wan't necessary to buy or sell it, would they still be starving?

[Amon_Re]

You said primitive cultures treat their livestock better than us. I was simply showing that is not the case.

All you "proved" is that they die slower.

Ahem, please open a history book. And ask the Kurds how things were going before we showed up. Are those AJ's words I'm hearing?

Tell that to Somalians. Like I said, spare me the freaking propaganda.

Yup! And after world hunger is ironed out by a bunch of tree-huggers on PC's, they can finally finish that perpetual motion machine they've been telling me about.

Strawman argument. There are enough resources to feed the whole world. There is however, no desire (no gain) to do so.

Yes it does. Which is why we use antibiotics. Yes, the bugs get stronger as our medicine advances, It's an arms race. One we're winning.

1) Never underestimate nature
2) It's sheer stupidity
3) The quality of the meat produced is horrific

Um... They are the carriers. Typhoid Mary's of the animal kingdom. They don't get sick as often, but when the local farmer's chickens get sick, they probably got it from wild birds.

You can replace probably with most likely. But again, do you see those flocks of birds falling out of the sky? No? Do you understand why?
Do you know why you don't drop dead when you get a cold or a flu?

Saying something vehemently don't prove shit. Money is and has been the issue for centuries. You donate lots of meat to charities? Why not? Cause of money?

I never donate meat to charities, spoils too quickly

Wolverines, cats, even certain species of insect hunt for sport. Bull fighting... a cat toying with a mouse for a few hours... Chimps do the genocide thing on other chimps as well. Nature isn't all Kumbaya.

Again, this is completely besides the point. We have the choice to treat life stock better. We chose not to because we don't care or worship the $.

Gamey meat is better tasting than farm-raised?

Yes. And farm-raised meat tastes better then meat from animals grown in small cases and on steroids & meds.

All those eons of farming haven't taught us anything

All those 'eons' have taught us something. It's taught us to increase gain and decrease costs. Again, quantity != quality.

I can think of a number of crueler things I could do to a cat. Have any kids? Hover over them 24/7? Oh, so if I get a gal pregnant, we should give the cat to a 'shelter' (concentration camp)? Take responsibility? I am! For my species and my children. Fuck the other guy's till mine are squared away!

If you truly were to take responsibility you'd make sure your kid isn't left alone with cats (or dogs for that matter). What about teeth? Maybe you should pull the cat's teeth too? She might bite! (Actually, she is more likely to bite when declawed as those are her only means of defence left.)

No matter what excuse you bring up, declawing a cat is
A) Cruel
B) The lazy escape
C) An escape of your responsibility.

You should consider this before getting a cat, not punish the thing because you were too stupid to realize cats got claws.

Man, I don't even know how to respond to that. 'Timmy, you're not starving because of lack of food."
If food was so cheap and plentiful it wan't necessary to buy or sell it, would they still be starving?

Yes because there is no gain in giving away free food. You do realize what they do with food they can't sell right? It gets tossed on a landfill or used as manure because it's cheaper to dispose of it than to ship it to starving people.

Lack of food/resources isn't why people are starving. It's because we f'cking let them.

[Aussie2B]

For every 'humane' example of a lion killing there is, there's also bot flies, tapeworms, constricting snakes, venom that stuns but doesn't kill...
And look into the plight of the poor aphids before you assume we are the only species to keep others as chattle.

While technically, yes, insects are in the Animalia Kingdom, when people are talking about "animals" colloquially, they're typically talking about vertebrates (mammals, birds, reptiles, amphibians, and fish), rather than invertebrates. So, personally, all of your insect examples are irrelevant to my conversation. Your one vertebrate example, constricting snakes, go along with my statement just fine. They're still aiming for the quickest death they can get, and they're doing the best with the abilities of their bodies. I mean, what else can they do with no arms, legs, or venom?

Look into the amino acid differences between a steak and an equal amount of soy protein. There is a significant difference, and it's not trivial. Easy to compensate for in the civilized world. Not so much in Ethiopia.

And charities send nuts instead of steaks cause most of those countries are rife with corruption, and the meat won't reach it's destination. Nuts will.
And nuts are cheaper.

I fail to see what your argument is here. That the efforts of charities are worthless unless they send meat? If your starving, you should just be concerned with staying alive. Having a balanced, nutritionally complete diet is the ultimate goal, but, heck, even a lot of fat Americans that gorge themselves on meat don't have that. There's no arguing my point that we can feed the starving people of the world much more effectively with options other than meat. You said yourself that it's cheaper, and we all know that it takes far less money and land for agriculture than to produce meat. That's even ignoring the perishability factor. And my point about bushmeat.

Also, plenty of poor nations/cultures can compensate for a meatless diet. What, do you think only rich, white hipsters are vegetarians? A large percentage of the Indian population is vegetarian or vegan, and they're definitely not a first world country.

So the bottom line is that starving people have absolutely NOTHING to do with humane farming practices.

People just like to be judgmental and tell other people what to do. Like "How dare you care about how animals are treated when... blah blah blah?" More like how dare you try to enforce what I can and can't care about? The whole "this cause is more important than that cause" mentality is complete and utter BS. If you follow that train of thought, then I guess we shouldn't care at all about homeless and hungry people in America too because people in other countries have it so much worse, right? C'mon. These are ALL issues that deserve attention. There's no reason why someone can't care about the needless suffering of ALL life. Everybody could take a lesson from Saint Francis.

[tom]

If you truly were to take responsibility you'd make sure your kid isn't left alone with cats (or dogs for that matter). What about teeth? Maybe you should pull the cat's teeth too? She might bite! (Actually, she is more likely to bite when declawed as those are her only means of defence left.)

No matter what excuse you bring up, declawing a cat is
A) Cruel
B) The lazy escape
C) An escape of your responsibility.

You should consider this before getting a cat, not punish the thing because you were too stupid to realize cats got claws.

.

I'd get rid of the kid.

[Aswald]

Maybe someone should remind PETA of the survival chances of animals in their own shelters.....

In the meanwhile, I'll go eat some bacon.

Guess this has to be posted here...

http://sourcewatch.org/index.php?tit...lients_exposed


Fact is, PETA has strongly opposed the corporations. Since the corporations run the media, it is no surprise that any rumor started about them will be scooped up by the media.

It is along the same lines as the media hostility towards the "Occupy Wall Street" movement.

[Amon_Re]

I'd get rid of the kid.

And waste all that sweet, sweet meat?!

[tpugmire]

I'm against animal cruelty and all that, but I'd totally kill a tanuki without hesitation if it would grant me the power of flight.

[Ryaan1234]

http://www.valleycentral.com/news/story.aspx?id=687268

More stupidity from PETA.

[The Shawn]

No matter what excuse you bring up, declawing a cat is
A) Cruel
B) The lazy escape
C) An escape of your responsibility.

You are truly out of touch with reality.
Perhaps you speak cat?
If so you should ask one if they would prefer to be 'put to sleep' in a shelter or be declawed and stay with the same loving family. Besides, what purpose do their claws serve when they are indoor cat's?

Our cat just died, he was 17, he was declawed. For good reason also.


I could debunk pretty much all your views, as you don't seem to grasp particular concepts as well as other folks responding in this thread who are Pro-animal welfare. But I won't bother.

This really should be moved to OT.

[RP2A03]

Tofurky, Texas?

[Bad Atom]

I think the real question that needs to be asked is, how does PETA feel about the Frog Suit???

[treismac]

Own an aggressive cat and a small child at the same time. Bye-bye claws.

Naw. Give the small child a wiffle bat and teach him what it means to be a man.

[treismac]

I'm against animal cruelty and all that, but I'd totally kill a tanuki without hesitation if it would grant me the power of flight.

Oh, God, yes!!! I bet the people at PETA would, too, if they were honest with themselves. I mean, they aren't that cute, are they?



Oh... That's pretty darn cute, I suppose. I didn't wanna really fly all that much anyway.